Watching NuWho

[Jock Ewing Fan]

You've left out one crucial key player at the BBC who was really responsible for the shows returning in 2005. Lorraine Hegessey was the Controller of BBC One in 2003 and it was her who re-commissioned Doctor Who as a new series.

Thanks for the info. As usual, your posts are good, informative ones

 

[Jock Ewing Fan]

I wasn't suggesting otherwise. I love the fact that last week's Beatles episode, 'Flux', 'Trial of a Time Lord' (even though I didn't enjoy a lot of 'Trial of a Time Lord') and 'An Unearthly Child', while each completely different to each other, are all part of the same thing. I really enjoy zigzagging through different eras. That's what's so fun about the massive historical chronological video I'm working my way through: one minute you're watching the whole of ‘The Space Museum’ in the wrong order followed by five seconds of Peter Capaldi and Jenna Coleman, then a glimpse of Tom Baker and Lalla Ward, followed by four episodes of 'Time Flight'.

I said they take it more seriously, not too seriously. But granted, it was a generalisation: fandom is made up of many individuals who don't necessarily all share the same opinion of every aspect of Who. But then, that makes me wonder: if, as you say, the opinions of the fandom are important and should be acted upon by the programme makers, which opinions are they meant to take notice of? Some of Steven Moffat's episodes have been voted the most popular in all of Who, yet he was driven off social media because a sizeable chunk of "the fandom" were so horrible about his run of the show. You clearly dislike the Chibnall era yet others were very moved by and deeply invested in the Doctor's relationship with Yaz. There's lots of positivity about the newest episodes while a vocal contingent are disgusted at how "woke" (such a meaningless word) they are. Who gets to decide which opinions have more credibility and should be taken notice of?

Good Question. Who decides?
Everyone and No one, I guess, but some opinions are more informed, more layered, have more depth.
The name of the show is good starting point.
Doctor Who?
It is a mystery, a question that can be explored but not resolved. The question remains unanswered
That is perhaps Chibnall's greatest failing. He showed no respect for the show's narrative history
with that contradictory, downright false origin story.
The 7th Doctor era and Matt Smith's era, to an extent, explored the Doctor's back story, but
did not establish any specific answer, which maintains the mystery.
And that era was objectively terrible with record to near record low ratings, record low Appreciation Index (which is a measure of
how the audience views the quality of the show) and merchandise disappearing from the shelves noticeably
in large quantities. Fan sites, websites and utub videos had large numbers of fans who expressed their dissatisfaction
Even Rotten Tomatoes had record low Audience Appreciation scores
Also The return of RTD as well as people on the production team who were part of the relaunch David Tennant's return
were clear indicators that the franchise was in a downward spiral, and needed repair.
I haven't seen the new season, but NG seems to be a good actor with a lot of talent,
maybe he will do well. I certainly hope so.

 

[Oh!Carol Christmasson]

or the most part, it was until the disastrous Chibnall/JW era, in large part because he disrespected the shows origins.

River Song: The Doctor always lies.

I'm going to take these big revelations with a pinch of salt because it can all be revealed as a Doctor scheme to deceive whatever adversary.
You just need to be patient J.E.F.

 

[Jock Ewing Fan]

Christopher Eccleston was really good. Too bad he was only on for one season.
Apparently he had issues with the original production team
He liked Moffat, but didn't return for 50
A shame - I would much have preferred him in 50 to John Hurt.
JH is a great actor, but his Doctor seemed somewhat average and underplayed, at least IMHO
50 was OK, but somewhat underwhelming, at least IMHO
No classic series Doctors
except for the brilliant "Curator" played by Tom Baker
Billie Piper - good to see her return, but didn't care for her role.
Great to see DT return, but the script didn't seem to utilize as best as possible.
Inspired use of the Zygons was a plus
I think Eccleston and Capaldi were the two best actors to play the Doctor since the relaunch
Certainly, DT was great as the Doctor too, and Matt Smith was enjoyable

 

[Jock Ewing Fan]

Ratings:
Episode 1: 4.01 million
Episode 2: 3.91 million

This is disappointing.
A lot now depends on how Disney views these ratings.
If ratings do not improve, what will Disney do?
Doctor who is going to have 2 seasons of 8 episodes.
If Disney does not renew, what will happen?

I can't comment on content because I have not seen the episodes.
It seemed that the show had recovered with the David Tennant shows but now...what?
NG seemed to be a good choice for the role Maybe he needs better written material

Doctor Who ratings revealed for first week of season 14

The numbers are in!

www.radiotimes.com

 

[Whovian]

Ratings:
Episode 1: 4.01 million
Episode 2: 3.91 million

This is disappointing.
A lot now depends on how Disney views these ratings.
If ratings do not improve, what will Disney do?
Doctor who is going to have 2 seasons of 8 episodes.
If Disney does not renew, what will happen?

I can't comment on content because I have not seen the episodes.
It seemed that the show had recovered with the David Tennant shows but now...what?
NG seemed to be a good choice for the role Maybe he needs better written material

Doctor Who ratings revealed for first week of season 14

The numbers are in!

www.radiotimes.com

Disney won't give a damn about the BBC One ratings in the UK- they'll be interested in where it sits in the international charts in other countries where they actually hold the rights. It's comfortably in the Top 10 in many countries and seems to be doing quite well. I haven't watched the episodes yet, but the suggestion online seems to be the first two are crap but the third episode is good. Will interested to see if it picks up viewers in the +7 ratings after it's low overnight (we'll know on Monday).

The ratings need to be viewed in the context that TV ratings overall are far down on what they have been and seem to be tanking more every year. The specials got almost the same number of viewers as this years Eurovision - once a flagship event - they weren't going to sustain that into a new season. Yes the numbers are low but I really don't think it's the disaster many are spinning it as. The episodes finished 10th and 12th in the BARB weekly TV ratings, the shows had weekly chart rankings much lower than that in the past.

 

[Jock Ewing Fan]

Disney won't give a damn about the BBC One ratings in the UK- they'll be interested in where it sits in the international charts in other countries where they actually hold the rights. It's comfortably in the Top 10 in many countries and seems to be doing quite well. I haven't watched the episodes yet, but the suggestion online seems to be the first two are crap but the third episode is good. Will interested to see if it picks up viewers in the +7 ratings after it's low overnight (we'll know on Monday).

The ratings need to be viewed in the context that TV ratings overall are far down on what they have been and seem to be tanking more every year. The specials got almost the same number of viewers as this years Eurovision - once a flagship event - they weren't going to sustain that into a new season. Yes the numbers are low but I really don't think it's the disaster many are spinning it as. The episodes finished 10th and 12th in the BARB weekly TV ratings, the shows had weekly chart rankings much lower than that in the past.

Good points. It does sound like Disney will be the ultimate decider.
Hopefully, Disney doesn't impair Doctor Who like they have with Marvel.
Doctor Who does have one advantage. Unlike Star Wars and Indiana Jones, Kathleen Kennedy has no apparent input.

 

[Whovian]

As an addendum to the above. here's the list of highest and lowest TV ratings for episodes up to The Devil's Chord's. New Series identified in bold.

Top 10 Highest TV Ratings
01 16.1 City of Death - Part 4 (Saturday 20 October 1979) [Season 17]
02 15.4 City of Death - Part 3 (Saturday 13 October 1979) [Season 17]
03 14.4 Destiny of the Daleks - Part 4 (Saturday 22 September 1979) [Season 17]
04 14.1 City of Death - Part 2 (Saturday 6 October 1979) [Season 17]
05 13.8 Destiny of the Daleks - Part 3 (Saturday15 September 1979) [Season 17]
06 13.6 The Ark in Space - Part 2 (Saturday 1 February 1975) [Season 12]
07 13.5 The Web Planet - Part 1 (Saturday 13 February 1965) [Season 2]
08 13.31 The Voyage of the Damned (Tuesday 25 December 2007) [Christmas Special]
09 13.1 The Robots of Death - Part 3 (Saturday 12 February 1977) [Season 14]
10 13.1 The Next Doctor (Thursday 25 December 2008) [2008-2010 Special]

Top 10 Lowest TV Ratings
01 3.1 Battlefield - Part 1 (Wednesday 6 September 1989) [Season 26]
02 3.47 The Legend of the Sea Devils (Sunday 17 April 2022) [2022 Special]
03 3.5 The War Games - Episode 8 (Saturday 7 June 1969) [Season 6]
04 3.6 Battlefield - Part 3 (Wednesday 20 September 1989) [Season 26]
05 3.7 Full Circle - Part 2 (Saturday 1 November 1980) [Season 18]
05 3.7 The Mysterious Planet - Part 4 (Saturday 27 September 1986) [Season 23]
07 3.9 The Mysterious Planet - Part 3 (Saturday 20 September 1986 [Season 23]
07 3.9 Battlefield - Part 2 (Wednesday 13 September 1989) [Season 26]
09 3.91 The Devil's Chord (Saturday 11 May 2024) [Series 14]
10 4.0 Battlefield - Part 4 (Wednesday 27 September 1989 [Season 26]
10 4.0 Ghost Light - Part Part 2 (Wednesday 11 October 1989) [Season 26]
10 4.0 Ghost Light - Part Part 3 (Wednesday 18 October 1989) [Season 26]
10 4.0 The Curse of Fenric - Part 2 (Wednesday 1 November 1989) [Season 26]
10 4.0 The Curse of Fenric - Part 3 (Wednesday 8 November 1989) [Season 26]


Space Babies just narrowly escape the Top 10 with 4.01m viewers - although that is mainly because figures were rounded to .1 during the classic run rather than the .01 used in the new series ratings.

 

[Jock Ewing Fan]

As an addendum to the above. here's the list of highest and lowest TV ratings for episodes up to The Devil's Chord's. New Series identified in bold.

Top 10 Highest TV Ratings
01 16.1 City of Death - Part 4 (Saturday 20 October 1979) [Season 17]
02 15.4 City of Death - Part 3 (Saturday 13 October 1979) [Season 17]
03 14.4 Destiny of the Daleks - Part 4 (Saturday 22 September 1979) [Season 17]
04 14.1 City of Death - Part 2 (Saturday 6 October 1979) [Season 17]
05 13.8 Destiny of the Daleks - Part 3 (Saturday15 September 1979) [Season 17]
06 13.6 The Ark in Space - Part 2 (Saturday 1 February 1975) [Season 12]
07 13.5 The Web Planet - Part 1 (Saturday 13 February 1965) [Season 2]
08 13.31 The Voyage of the Damned (Tuesday 25 December 2007) [Christmas Special]
09 13.1 The Robots of Death - Part 3 (Saturday 12 February 1977) [Season 14]
10 13.1 The Next Doctor (Thursday 25 December 2008) [2008-2010 Special]

Top 10 Lowest TV Ratings
01 3.1 Battlefield - Part 1 (Wednesday 6 September 1989) [Season 26]
02 3.47 The Legend of the Sea Devils (Sunday 17 April 2022) [2022 Special]
03 3.5 The War Games - Episode 8 (Saturday 7 June 1969) [Season 6]
04 3.6 Battlefield - Part 3 (Wednesday 20 September 1989) [Season 26]
05 3.7 Full Circle - Part 2 (Saturday 1 November 1980) [Season 18]
05 3.7 The Mysterious Planet - Part 4 (Saturday 27 September 1986) [Season 23]
07 3.9 The Mysterious Planet - Part 3 (Saturday 20 September 1986 [Season 23]
07 3.9 Battlefield - Part 2 (Wednesday 13 September 1989) [Season 26]
09 3.91 The Devil's Chord (Saturday 11 May 2024) [Series 14]
10 4.0 Battlefield - Part 4 (Wednesday 27 September 1989 [Season 26]
10 4.0 Ghost Light - Part Part 2 (Wednesday 11 October 1989) [Season 26]
10 4.0 Ghost Light - Part Part 3 (Wednesday 18 October 1989) [Season 26]
10 4.0 The Curse of Fenric - Part 2 (Wednesday 1 November 1989) [Season 26]
10 4.0 The Curse of Fenric - Part 3 (Wednesday 8 November 1989) [Season 26]


Space Babies just narrowly escape the Top 10 with 4.01m viewers - although that is mainly because figures were rounded to .1 during the classic run rather than the .01 used in the new series ratings.

Thanks for the info.

Just one thought.

Since the Capaldi era, possibly the Matt Smit era, the ratings have been consolidated over a time period.

This may have an effect on the list, since overnight ratings would be more comparable to classic series and earlier episodes
of the relaunch

 

[Whovian]

Thanks for the info.

Just one thought.

Since the Capaldi era, possibly the Matt Smit era, the ratings have been consolidated over a time period.

This may have an effect on the list, since overnight ratings would be more comparable to classic series and earlier episodes
of the relaunch

Yeah it's not perfect but seemed best to use the 'official' figures.

Viewing habits are very different now. The ratings method was actually changed to account for this fact - and the fact that overnights were becoming less and less relevant with the birth of iPlayer and other streaming platforms. It's generally accepted to use consolidated figures where they are available (modern era) and the overnights for when they were the only available figures (Classic Era and early NuWho) - especially much of the original run you watched it live or missed it.

Yes it's not perfect but it's definitely better to use +7s rather than overnights for the modern show as viewing habits have changed that much. It also helps when comparing it to other TV shows as that's how the ratings are calculated across the board now - and how we know Space Babies and Devil's Chord were beaten in the weekly chart by Coronation Street. People trying (not aimed at you by the way) to cite the overnights and compare them to old overnights usually seem to have an agenda to try and show the show up as doing badly so they can moan about the direction it's gone. We can accept the show's not in a great place without trying to make the statistics look even worse than they actually are.

For example Boom had the worst overnight in Doctor Who history at 2.04m but it's very possible due to word of mouth it could end up beating Space Babies and The Devil's Chord in the consolidated ratings. The ratings should be reflecting that rather than using overnights just because that's what we used to use.

The biggest impact on the list is actually the 1979 ITV strike which left the BBC as the only broadcaster and meant more eyes watching Doctor Who than normal and how City of Death got such high viewing figures.

 

[James from London]

I'm really enjoying watching new Who every Saturday morning. It really doesn't matter to me how many other people are watching. It's got the vibe of an anthology series at the moment, like Inside No 9 -- or maybe mid-period X-Files when it was at its most experimental. You get the feeling each episode could be about anything.

I'm also loving my historical-chronological journey through Who. In the space of fifteen minutes yesterday, I visited all these adventures:

 

[James from London]

 

[James from London]

 

[Whovian]

Boom has a nightmare in the +7s and is the 2nd lowest watched episode of the New Series. Tidies the list up somewhat as it removes the mass tie at No 10 of serials with 4.0m.

Top 10 Highest TV Ratings
01 16.1 City of Death - Part 4 (Saturday 20 October 1979) [Season 17]
02 15.4 City of Death - Part 3 (Saturday 13 October 1979) [Season 17]
03 14.4 Destiny of the Daleks - Part 4 (Saturday 22 September 1979) [Season 17]
04 14.1 City of Death - Part 2 (Saturday 6 October 1979) [Season 17]
05 13.8 Destiny of the Daleks - Part 3 (Saturday15 September 1979) [Season 17]
06 13.6 The Ark in Space - Part 2 (Saturday 1 February 1975) [Season 12]
07 13.5 The Web Planet - Part 1 (Saturday 13 February 1965) [Season 2]
08 13.31 The Voyage of the Damned (Tuesday 25 December 2007) [Christmas Special]
09 13.1 The Robots of Death - Part 3 (Saturday 12 February 1977) [Season 14]
10 13.1 The Next Doctor (Thursday 25 December 2008) [2008-2010 Special]

Top 10 Lowest TV Ratings
01 3.1 Battlefield - Part 1 (Wednesday 6 September 1989) [Season 26]
02 3.47 The Legend of the Sea Devils (Sunday 17 April 2022) [2022 Special]
03 3.5 The War Games - Episode 8 (Saturday 7 June 1969) [Season 6]
04 3.58 Boom (Saturday 18 May 2024) [Series 14]
05 3.6 Battlefield - Part 3 (Wednesday 20 September 1989) [Season 26]
06 3.7 Full Circle - Part 2 (Saturday 1 November 1980) [Season 18]
07 3.7 The Mysterious Planet - Part 4 (Saturday 27 September 1986) [Season 23]
08 3.9 The Mysterious Planet - Part 3 (Saturday 20 September 1986 [Season 23]
09 3.9 Battlefield - Part 2 (Wednesday 13 September 1989) [Season 26]
10 3.91 The Devil's Chord (Saturday 11 May 2024) [Series 14]

 

[Jock Ewing Fan]

ratings for'73 Yards'

2.62 million

I do not know how Disney thinks about the ratings.
The new platform is so different from the past ones.
As a result of Disney's involvement, the international market may be the biggest concern
We will know more, I suppose, if Disney continues its' involvement past new season 2

I haven't seen the episodes.
From what I have read, Ncuti Gatwa is quite good in the role
The big bad?
Lots of speculation.
Since it is someone that the Toymaker is hesitant to meet,
it would not be another Time Lord, since he was willing to meet the Doctor(s)
That eliminates the Master, Rani, Meddling Monk, Borusa, Iris, Morbius, Valeyard, River Song, probably Omega
Guesses? Black Guardian, Sutek, Fenric, maybe Rassilon has evolved beyond a Time Lord

On another note, I don't believe Gallifrey has been destroyed. there will be some sort of reveal.

MSN

www.msn.com

 

[Whovian]

ratings for'73 Yards'

2.62 million

I do not know how Disney thinks about the ratings.
The new platform is so different from the past ones.
As a result of Disney's involvement, the international market may be the biggest concern
We will know more, I suppose, if Disney continues its' involvement past new season 2

I haven't seen the episodes.
From what I have read, Ncuti Gatwa is quite good in the role
The big bad?
Lots of speculation.
Since it is someone that the Toymaker is hesitant to meet,
it would not be another Time Lord, since he was willing to meet the Doctor(s)
That eliminates the Master, Rani, Meddling Monk, Borusa, Iris, Morbius, Valeyard, River Song, probably Omega
Guesses? Black Guardian, Sutek, Fenric, maybe Rassilon has evolved beyond a Time Lord

On another note, I don't believe Gallifrey has been destroyed. there will be some sort of reveal.

MSN

www.msn.com

That's an overnight rating rather than a consolidated one - if it tracks in line with the last few episodes it should add about 1.5m for a rating of 4.16m or so - we'll find out on Monday afternoon. It's the best overnight of the series.

I think if we see Gallifrey restored it'll be in the back end of Series 15. Probably don't want to overwhelm the casual audience there chasing with such a lore heavy storyline at this point.

 

[Jock Ewing Fan]

That's an overnight rating rather than a consolidated one - if it tracks in line with the last few episodes it should add about 1.5m for a rating of 4.16m or so - we'll find out on Monday afternoon. It's the best overnight of the series.

I think if we see Gallifrey restored it'll be in the back end of Series 15. Probably don't want to overwhelm the casual audience there chasing with such a lore heavy storyline at this point.

Yes, the consolidated ratings are not available yet.
You are probably right about Gallifrey.

 

[Jock Ewing Fan]

That's an overnight rating rather than a consolidated one - if it tracks in line with the last few episodes it should add about 1.5m for a rating of 4.16m or so - we'll find out on Monday afternoon. It's the best overnight of the series.

I think if we see Gallifrey restored it'll be in the back end of Series 15. Probably don't want to overwhelm the casual audience there chasing with such a lore heavy storyline at this point.

Thinking about Gallifrey...
A possible scenario

We know that the Toymaker has manipulated the Doctor's past, so that even the Doctor's own memories are
not accurate for quite some time. Furthermore, the Toymaker probably recruited the Master to further the manipulation, so that the Master's
explanation of of Gallifrey is a deception.
What the Doctor saw was a "false" Gallifrey.
The Master was given authority over the Real Gallifrey, as a prize for acting on the Toymaker's plan.
When the Master's schemes backfired, inevitably,
he failed the Toymaker and had to play the Toymaker's game, which he lost

The "real" Gallifrey' is in some sort of dormant state.
Just a possible scenario

 

[James from London]

If last week's Who was like an anthology episode of Inside No 9, this week's is like an anthology episode of Black Mirror. Also vibes of "The Macra Terror", "The Happiness Patrol" and "Smile", i.e. it's about another utopian society that's really more of a nightmare.

There's a theme of some kind of physical restraint or obstacle running through these last few episodes: the Doctor unable to move or everyone will die; Ruby seeing the same person for years but always at the exact same distance; a girl who can't function outside of her bubble.

I can't keep track of the state of Gallifrey's existence. I feel like it doesn't really matter, except for in the episodes where it does matter.

 

[Jock Ewing Fan]

If last week's Who was like an anthology episode of Inside No 9, this week's is like an anthology episode of Black Mirror. Also vibes of "The Macra Terror", "The Happiness Patrol" and "Smile", i.e. it's about another utopian society that's really more of a nightmare.

There's a theme of some kind of physical restraint or obstacle running through these last few episodes: the Doctor unable to move or everyone will die; Ruby seeing the same person for years but always at the exact same distance; a girl who can't function outside of her bubble.

I can't keep track of the state of Gallifrey's existence. I feel like it doesn't really matter, except for in the episodes where it does matter.

The utopian society has always been a popular topic in sci-fi.
I think you could add "Galaxy Four" to the list
Unfortunately, the episodes are among the "lost"
I think that at least one partial film clip is still in existence

The theme sounds like something from the Moffatt/Matt Smith era.
Moffatt, more than any other showrunner,
explored the complexities of time travel, and its' paradoxes and contradictions.
Sometimes it was great, other times a bit difficult to understand