Dallas Character Did Laurel Ellis have any redeeming qualities at all whatsoever?

Angela Channing

Telly Talk Veteran
I've always considered Laurel Ellis to be one of the worst characters ever on Dallas. Ghastly storyline, ghastly writing, ghastly acting, just everything about her was, well, ghastly!

I thought there was more life in her painting than their was in Annabel Schofield's portrayal of the character. It wasn't entirely her fault as everything about the plot she was in was just so ghastly done, including JR's coercive control of her which forced her to have sex with him.

Was there anything that anyone liked about the character or the storyline in which she was involved?

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Sarah

Moderator Emerita
She had great knock... :fp:

Em... no. She seemed nice at the beginning until Clayton fell for her then she just got really boring. Like almost Beaumont Boring (but not quite). She wasn’t even interesting enough to be nasty or anything. Just boring and vacant.

Dallas was sadly starting to really change beyond what we knew by here.

And I keep getting her mixed up with that tennis player.
 

Angela Channing

Telly Talk Veteran
She had great knock... :fp:

Em... no. She seemed nice at the beginning until Clayton fell for her then she just got really boring. Like almost Beaumont Boring (but not quite). She wasn’t even interesting enough to be nasty or anything. Just boring and vacant.

Dallas was sadly starting to really change beyond what we knew by here.

And I keep getting her mixed up with that tennis player.
Even in the beginning I found her bland and the wooden way she was portrayed didn't help. Vanessa was infinitely more interesting than Laurel, not because the character was especially interesting but because she brought James into the show which created a new dynamic for the series. The most interesting thing Laurel brought into the show was bonsai plants.
 

Sarah

Moderator Emerita
Disliked the storyline intensely especially when JR forces her into sex. Contrived to give Clayton something to do but I bet Howard Keel didn’t care much for it :)
It wasn’t so unbelievable that Clayton fall for a younger woman. I mean he did before. So did Jock. But the way it was done and her involvement with that creepy Shulton guy was just terrible. Even if she had reminded him of Amy or had similar interests. But he fell more for the painting than her.
 

Angela Channing

Telly Talk Veteran
Imho, the worst part of the story was Mss Ellie's reaction: getting drunk and that "...And They Break Your Heart!!!" cringy speech she gave to Sue Ellen. This seemed so out of character for her, and Barbara Bel Geddes deserved so much better.
I love Barbara and thought she was an amazingly good actress but I thought even she was a bit hammy in that scene. I think the whole Laurel Ellis storyline brought out the worst in all the actors involved.
 

Sarah

Moderator Emerita
The older I get the more I realise that some of the writers from this later season onwards really should have had their pad and pens taken off them at the door. I was 14 when these stories were happening and on my first visit to the States (to California). And I honestly wanted go to Lorimar and beg them to listen to me about the direction they were taking the show in. In my childhood brain I really thought I could just walk in and change it all. But I cared for our show in a way those later season writers didn’t.
 

Miss Texas 1967

Telly Talk Addict
For me, this for the most part was just the ‘who the hell are these people?!’ season. JR included. Wish this one had been a dream and most that followed it. :(
When you start getting scenes without a Ewing or close Ewing contact in them that's where Dallas in both forms (TNT especially) starts to lose itself . Laurel and David scenes, Liz and Johnny Dancer, Jory and Kit... :confuse:
 

Snarky Oracle!

Telly Talk Supreme
Imho, the worst part of the story was Miss Ellie's reaction: getting drunk and that "...And They Break Your Heart!!!" cringy speech she gave to Sue Ellen. This seemed so out of character for her, and Barbara Bel Geddes deserved so much better.

It's been pointed out that BBG gave us her best Winnie the Pooh in this scene -- and she did!

 

James from London

International Treasure
Was there anything that anyone liked about the character or the storyline in which she was involved?

I like these things:

I like what Laurel symbolises. What Laurel is to Clayton, Jeanne O’Brien will be to Bobby in a couple of years time and arguably what Mandy Winger was to JR a couple of years earlier — an elusive beauty who first captivates him from afar (JR and Bobby fall for Mandy and Jeanne upon spotting them across a crowded room; Clayton becomes infatuated by Laurel as a nameless girl in a painting), then gets under his macho defences rendering him undone, before finally enabling him to resolve some greater issue in his life — Bobby's relationship with Jeanne allows him to say goodbye to Pam, while Clayton and Laurel's storyline eventually results in him becoming half-owner of Southfork and therefore, finally, an equal to Miss Ellie. Strictly speaking, it’s Sue Ellen more than JR who ultimately benefits most from Mandy's presence as she is the one who is transformed from drunken doormat to the Queen of Lingerie. The elusive women themselves each meet very different fates: Mandy becomes a star, Laurel a rape victim, while Jeanne is returned to her ordinary life as if “none of that happened.”

There’s something quite touching about Clayton’s ‘I’m Not in Love’ walrus-doth-protest-too-much crush on Laurel, and she’s kind of perfect as the young and lovely, but not quite real, object of his affections.

I really like Laurel’s gang too — painter David Shulton is an enjoyable variation on Jeff Farraday from Season 4 — another schlubby blackmailer whose murder gets pinned on someone in the opening credits. There’s a memorable restaurant scene between David and Laurel where, rather than picking daintily at his food like most characters do so they can say their lines without any food in their mouths, he just goes for it: managing to stuff his face and deliver his dialogue — impressive! Then there’s Laurel's ex, Brett Lomax, a snobby Englishman (is there any other kind?). His xenophobic contempt for Texas and its inhabitants is really fun: “What is there for you here, living in this foreign place surrounded by people who … hardly speak our language?” he asks Laurel witheringly. And, of course, knowing that Brett will eventually transmogrify into FALCON CREST Anti-Christ Charley St James adds an extra level of interest to his scenes.

Then there are the consequences of Clayton’s potent but ultimately platonic relationship with Laurel, which bears more than a passing resemblance to Jock’s with Julie Grey. In fact, his explanation when Miss Ellie confronts him about it is almost a carbon copy of Jock's ten years earlier: “She made me feel like a man again. Everyone else was making me feel like a damned invalid, most of all you.” Whereas Ellie met Jock’s indiscretion with authority and stoicism, times have changed. Now she’s older, more vulnerable, more frightened. “What about me? What about me?” she keeps asking. It’s the most interesting she’s been all season. Plus, her drunk scene shows us an aspect of the character we’ve never really seen before and gives the actress a chance to really bust loose.

The interest JR takes in what is really a B-List storyline gives “Last of the Good Guys” (aka The One Where He Forces Himself on Laurel) the feel of a stand-alone instalment from DALLAS’s early days. Indeed, one could imagine the whole Clayton/Laurel/Shulton/Lomax/JR plot being edited rather neatly into one hour-long episode.

Ostensibly to shield her from the media scrutiny surrounding Clayton’s arrest, JR instals Laurel in the Ewing condo. Laurel is grateful, even more so when he tells her he can prove Clayton’s innocence. But then he drops the other cowboy boot. “If Harry doesn’t get a call from me,” he explains, pressing himself up against her, “he’s gonna put Lomax on a nonstop plane to London … Clayton’s fate is in your hands.” “So now the payoff,” she realises. “sex in return for freeing Clayton … You bastard!”

JR’s rape of Holly Harwood five years earlier had a similar dynamic: the woman makes her position clear (Holly: “Take your hands off me, JR — I don’t want this”; Laurel: “Don’t touch me — I can’t stand you”), only JR persists, not by using physical violence but a different form of coercion to force her into submission. The main difference between the two events is that this is not part of a bigger narrative for JR. Having dominance over Laurel isn’t tied to his season-long quest to take over West Star in the way that teaching Holly a lesson was a part of his ongoing efforts to win control of Ewing Oil. He rapes Laurel simply because he wants to. The show doesn’t refer to it as rape, of course. Instead, the episode ends on an ironic note with Clayton and Miss Ellie thanking him for saving the day. “My only motive was to help the family,” he insists. As far as everyone onscreen is concerned, it’s a happy ending. However, there remains a complicity between JR and the viewer — we alone understand the double meaning of his final line: “Oh Mama, you have no idea what getting Clayton off the hook meant to me.” And it’s this very complicity that first drew us to this man, this show, this genre, nearly a decade earlier and kept us coming back week after week, season after season. A lot has happened since then, of course — characters have grown older and softer, the spectacle of Rich People Behaving Badly has lost most of its shock value, and the genre as a whole has become increasingly familiar, even cosy at times. But as the frame freezes on an unrepentant JR chuckling, it’s almost, almost as if the episode is reminding us of those early days and saying, “This is what you fell for back then. This is the monster you created.”

I used to think Laurel was somewhat inconsequential in the scheme of things, but her relationship with Clayton actually sets in motion a significant chain of events. She’s the catalyst for Clayton and Miss Ellie’s marriage crisis which is finally resolved by Miss Ellie giving Clayton part ownership of Southfork. This, in turn, leads to JR moving off the ranch and into the Ewing condo, the scene of his cliffhanging showdown with Sue Ellen and Nicholas Pearce. It’s hard to imagine that showdown happening anywhere else — Ewing Oil, maybe, except the windows don’t open so there’d be nothing for Nicholas to fall out of. He'd just bang his bouffanted head and that'd be that.
 
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I've always considered Laurel Ellis to be one of the worst characters ever on Dallas. Ghastly storyline, ghastly writing, ghastly acting, just everything about her was, well, ghastly!

I thought there was more life in her painting than their was in Annabel Schofield's portrayal of the character. It wasn't entirely her fault as everything about the plot she was in was just so ghastly done, including JR's coercive control of her which forced her to have sex with him.

Was there anything that anyone liked about the character or the storyline in which she was involved?

With another actress in the role it could have been more interesting, but I totally agree with you, she was ghastly and I always throught the bonsais were more animated. As an actress her talents were somewhat limited

That season when Howard keel appeared on stage doing his UK tour in between filming Dallas he always did a 10 mins spot after the interval talking about his Dallas co stars - it kinda said it all when he couldnt remember the character or actresses name! Rather forgettable to say the least

I didnt like the storyline as again it was JR forcing himself on a woman and that wasnt a pleasant thought.
 

Angela Channing

Telly Talk Veteran
I like these things:

I like what Laurel symbolises. What Laurel is to Clayton, Jeanne O’Brien will be to Bobby in a couple of years time and arguably what Mandy Winger was to JR a couple of years earlier — an elusive beauty who first captivates him from afar (JR and Bobby fall for Mandy and Jeanne upon spotting them across a crowded room; Clayton becomes infatuated by Laurel as a nameless girl in a painting), then gets under his macho defences rendering him undone, before finally enabling him to resolve some greater issue in his life — Bobby's relationship with Jeanne allows him to say goodbye to Pam, while Clayton and Laurel's storyline eventually results in him becoming half-owner of Southfork and therefore, finally, an equal to Miss Ellie. Strictly speaking, it’s Sue Ellen more than JR who ultimately benefits most from Mandy's presence as she is the one who is transformed from drunken doormat to the Queen of Lingerie. The elusive women themselves each meet very different fates: Mandy becomes a star, Laurel a rape victim, while Jeanne is returned to her ordinary life as if “none of that happened.”

There’s something quite touching about Clayton’s ‘I’m Not in Love’ walrus-doth-protest-too-much crush on Laurel, and she’s kind of perfect as the young and lovely, but not quite real, object of his affections.

I really like Laurel’s gang too — painter David Shulton is an enjoyable variation on Jeff Farraday from Season 4 — another schlubby blackmailer whose murder gets pinned on someone in the opening credits. There’s a memorable restaurant scene between David and Laurel where, rather than picking daintily at his food like most characters do so they can say their lines without any food in their mouths, he just goes for it: managing to stuff his face and deliver his dialogue — impressive! Then there’s Laurel's ex, Brett Lomax, a snobby Englishman (is there any other kind?). His xenophobic contempt for Texas and its inhabitants is really fun: “What is there for you here, living in this foreign place surrounded by people who … hardly speak our language?” he asks Laurel witheringly. And, of course, knowing that Brett will eventually transmogrify into FALCON CREST Anti-Christ Charley St James adds an extra level of interest to his scenes.

Then there are the consequences of Clayton’s potent but ultimately platonic relationship with Laurel, which bears more than a passing resemblance to Jock’s with Julie Grey. In fact, his explanation when Miss Ellie confronts him about it is almost a carbon copy of Jock's ten years earlier: “She made me feel like a man again. Everyone else was making me feel like a damned invalid, most of all you.” Whereas Ellie met Jock’s indiscretion with authority and stoicism, times have changed. Now she’s older, more vulnerable, more frightened. “What about me? What about me?” she keeps asking. It’s the most interesting she’s been all season. Plus, her drunk scene shows us an aspect of the character we’ve never really seen before and gives the actress a chance to really bust loose.

The interest JR takes in what is really a B-List storyline gives “Last of the Good Guys” (aka The One Where He Forces Himself on Laurel) the feel of a stand-alone instalment from DALLAS’s early days. Indeed, one could imagine the whole Clayton/Laurel/Shulton/Lomax/JR plot being edited rather neatly into one hour-long episode.

Ostensibly to shield her from the media scrutiny surrounding Clayton’s arrest, JR instals Laurel in the Ewing condo. Laurel is grateful, even more so when he tells her he can prove Clayton’s innocence. But then he drops the other cowboy boot. “If Harry doesn’t get a call from me,” he explains, pressing himself up against her, “he’s gonna put Lomax on a nonstop plane to London … Clayton’s fate is in your hands.” “So now the payoff,” she realises. “sex in return for freeing Clayton … You bastard!”

JR’s rape of Holly Harwood five years earlier had a similar dynamic: the woman makes her position clear (Holly: “Take your hands off me, JR — I don’t want this”; Laurel: “Don’t touch me — I can’t stand you”), only JR persists, not by using physical violence but a different form of coercion to force her into submission. The main difference between the two events is that this is not part of a bigger narrative for JR. Having dominance over Laurel isn’t tied to his season-long quest to take over West Star in the way that teaching Holly a lesson was a part of his ongoing efforts to win control of Ewing Oil. He rapes Laurel simply because he wants to. The show doesn’t refer to it as rape, of course. Instead, the episode ends on an ironic note with Clayton and Miss Ellie thanking him for saving the day. “My only motive was to help the family,” he insists. As far as everyone onscreen is concerned, it’s a happy ending. However, there remains a complicity between JR and the viewer — we alone understand the double meaning of his final line: “Oh Mama, you have no idea what getting Clayton off the hook meant to me.” And it’s this very complicity that first drew us to this man, this show, this genre, nearly a decade earlier and kept us coming back week after week, season after season. A lot has happened since then, of course — characters have grown older and softer, the spectacle of Rich People Behaving Badly has lost most of its shock value, and the genre as a whole has become increasingly familiar, even cosy at times. But as the frame freezes on an unrepentant JR chuckling, it’s almost, almost as if the episode is reminding us of those early days and saying, “This is what you fell for back then. This is the monster you created.”

I used to think Laurel was somewhat inconsequential in the scheme of things, but her relationship with Clayton actually sets in motion a significant chain of events. She’s the catalyst for Clayton and Miss Ellie’s marriage crisis which is finally resolved by Miss Ellie giving Clayton part ownership of Southfork. This, in turn, leads to JR moving off the ranch and into the Ewing condo, the scene of his cliffhanging showdown with Sue Ellen and Nicholas Pearce. It’s hard to imagine that showdown happening anywhere else — Ewing Oil, maybe, except the windows don’t open so there’d be nothing for Nicholas to fall out of. He'd just bang his bouffanted head and that'd be that.
It's interesting to hear someone defend Laurel Ellis and her storyline and even more impressively you've done it by bringing in Dave Shulton (also ghastly), Brett Lomax (not quite as ghastly as Laurel and Shulton but still very ghastly) and Charley St James (Falcon Crest's most ghastly character) as part of the defence.

Your point about how the storyline reminded viewers of how wicked JR could be is a good one but the issue I have it that Laurel was such a ghastly character that I had very little sympathy for her which I know is an awful thing to say about a rape survivor. I can't help thinking how much more powerful that final scene with JR, Ellie and Clayton would have been if Laurel was a more sympathetic and likeable character but my main thought was "hallellujah, this looks like the end of this ghastly character being on the show."
 

James from London

International Treasure
It's interesting to hear someone defend Laurel Ellis and her storyline and even more impressively you've done it by bringing in Dave Shulton (also ghastly), Brett Lomax (not quite as ghastly as Laurel and Shulton but still very ghastly) and Charley St James (Falcon Crest's most ghastly character) as part of the defence.
Well, I wasn't so much defending the story, just saying what I like about it -- but, d'oh, I forgot the thing I like most! Mavis Anderson’s lovely final scene which brings her character full circle. Prompted by Miss Ellie confiding her suspicions about Clayton’s infidelity, she reveals that Punk also once had an affair with a younger woman and that she knew about it but never said anything. “It was shortly after Jock’s death,” she explains. “In fact, I’m pretty sure that’s what caused it.” This timeline puts the affair at around the same time Mavis first appeared onscreen as Ellie’s confidante encouraging her to resume public life following the loss of her husband. To think that Mavis would have been silently dealing with her own turmoil at the same time! We never knew, of course, because her function has always been to act as a sounding board for Miss Ellie’s problems. It’s only now, at the end, where we finally get a glimpse into her inner life.

I can't help thinking how much more powerful that final scene with JR, Ellie and Clayton would have been if Laurel was a more sympathetic and likeable character

What's interesting about the way the scene does play out is that instead of the show putting the emphasis on Laurel and her suffering and telling us how we're supposed to feel about it, that responsibility is put back onto the individual viewer. "As I'm watching JR chuckling away, how do I feel about the violent crime he's just committed and got away with scot-free? Do I even care?"
 
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