Katherine: The Aftermath

[Jimmy Todd]

After Katherine shot Bobby and during the Dream Season after she ran him down with her car, Katherine's motives were barely discussed. Miss Ellie did wonder aloud to Pam why she hated Bobby so much. Other than that she was just dismissed as crazy. No one commented on how she fooled everyone or wondered what drove her to this insanity.
Obviously, she became a plot device so the writers weren't going to spend any time on this, but would a brief one or two episode storyline where Pam or someone did some investigating, contemplaton, or conversation on the subject to make some sense of it add the the story? After all, Pam trusted Katherine and she was her sister.

 

[the-lost-son]

The character of Katherine was similar to Lady Jessica. These characters run their course and there is hardly any coming back.

Jessica's motives were shown beautifully - grounded in family drama.
Katherine's initial resentment to Cliff getting part of her Daddy's company, her involvement with JR were fine. But in the end it was irrational and sometimes she was a cartoonist villain for no apparent reason. Her hatred for Cliff&Pam was over the top.
I would have preferred a strong Barnes/Wentworth family as a counterpart to the Ewings. Rivalry within the family but united against outsiders, like the Ewings.

They did not know what to do with Katherine at some point which was showed especially during her clueless re-appearence when Pam was in hospital.

 

[tommie]

Katherine's initial resentment to Cliff getting part of her Daddy's company, her involvement with JR were fine. But in the end it was irrational and sometimes she was a cartoonist villain for no apparent reason. Her hatred for Cliff&Pam was over the top.
I would have preferred a strong Barnes/Wentworth family as a counterpart to the Ewings. Rivalry within the family but united against outsiders, like the Ewings.

They did not know what to do with Katherine at some point which was showed especially during her clueless re-appearence when Pam was in hospital.

I agree, but I think the issue was her obsession with Bobby never felt really properly explained. It would've made more sense if at least there had been a brief time where Bobby actually led her on in some way. Add that the way Katherine was introduced to the show was as a very serious and ambitious young woman - why would she throw everything away for him? It never felt like they built up properly to it.

 

[Victoriafan3]

By the time Katherine reappeared at the hospital to see Pam, they didn’t know what to to with the whole show by that point, let alone with her ;-)

 

[Billy Wall]

The character of Katherine was similar to Lady Jessica. These characters run their course and there is hardly any coming back.

Jessica's motives were shown beautifully - grounded in family drama.
Katherine's initial resentment to Cliff getting part of her Daddy's company, her involvement with JR were fine. But in the end it was irrational and sometimes she was a cartoonist villain for no apparent reason. Her hatred for Cliff&Pam was over the top.
I would have preferred a strong Barnes/Wentworth family as a counterpart to the Ewings. Rivalry within the family but united against outsiders, like the Ewings.

They did not know what to do with Katherine at some point which was showed especially during her clueless re-appearence when Pam was in hospital.

One thing I’d disagree with you on. Her hatred for Cliff is more than justified. He embezzled money from her dad’s company and was a VERY big reason she lost her mother and then his greedy ass got a huge chunk of that very same company that her dad built.

 

[Jimmy Todd]

One thing I’d disagree with you on. Her hatred for Cliff is more than justified. He embezzled money from her dad’s company and was a VERY big reason she lost her mother and then his greedy ass got a huge chunk of that very same company that her dad built.

Along that line it would have been cool if during the scene when Pam confronts her about the letter she suddenly blew up at Pam, screaming that Pam had a husband a baby and a fortune from Katherine's father's company which she didn't deserve, and if Pam was stupid enough to throw Bobby away, that's her problem. Instead, Katherine is the calm, smug one dimensional film noirish femme fatale. Until Pam slaps her, that is.
Katherine gave up her career to move to Dallas to stalk Bobby. As JR said, "If we could bottle Bobby's charm, we would make more money than from oil."

 

[DallasFanForever]

There is that scene in the dream season where Cliff shows Pam Katherine’s diary and it does explain her motivation for some of what she did. But even with that explanation I felt like we were left with a lot of questions about her. But maybe that was just the magic of Katherine? Maybe we were never supposed to know what was going on in that mind. Maybe her reasons for what she did were always meant to be left open to interpretation?

 

[the-lost-son]

Along that line it would have been cool if during the scene when Pam confronts her about the letter she suddenly blew up at Pam, screaming that Pam had a husband a baby and a fortune from Katherine's father's company which she didn't deserve, and if Pam was stupid enough to throw Bobby away, that's her problem. Instead, Katherine is the calm, smug one dimensional film noirish femme fatale. Until Pam slaps her, that is.
Katherine gave up her career to move to Dallas to stalk Bobby. As JR said, "If we could bottle Bobby's charm, we would make more money than from oil."

In season 6 (DVD 7) there was so much going on. So many storylines needed to come to an end _ Peter Richards, Cliff&JR& Gold Canyon 340, Lady Jessica, establishing plenty of suspects for Bobby's shooting... It's possible they did not have enough time to portray Katherine's motivation. They did not have time (or decided not to show) Ellie&Clayton's wedding either.

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned -- it's the oldest motivation in the book.

I agree, though, that a little of Katherine's motivation about losing two-thirds of her father's empire could have been given a little discussion on screen.

I also agree that Katherine was a lot like Lady Jessica in certain ways. But then, all the sisters-in-law were nuts. And one of the dangers of having a nutbag character is the writers' sense that little motivation is required beyond: 'she be nutz!'

"I'm tellin' you -- she's crazy..!"

 

[lbf522]

Katherine was wasted. I would have preferred her challenging her mother's will in court (Rebecca was wrong giving Cliff and Pamela part of her late husband's company) instead of her obsessing over Bobby and bedding with JR.

 

[Billy Wall]

Katherine was wasted. I would have preferred her challenging her mother's will in court (Rebecca was wrong giving Cliff and Pamela part of her late husband's company) instead of her obsessing over Bobby and bedding with JR.

I totally agree, but I don’t know if they’d want to have another “challenge the will” storyline right after Miss Ellie challenged Jock’s will.

 

[the-lost-son]

I totally agree, but I don’t know if they’d want to have another “challenge the will” storyline right after Miss Ellie challenged Jock’s will.

I agree, too. In retrospect the union if the Barnes Clan was too short-lived. Rebecca's death contributed to great storylines like the slow, sad break-up of Bobby&Pam and Cliff trying to prove himself as oilman.

I wish Rebecca stayed longer and gave the Ewing a hard time, like she told Ellie "now we're even. And I have the money to do it." That was Dallas at its best - many Ewing, many Barneses. I love these matriarchs, Ellie, Angela in Falcon Crest...

In the later years Katherine and Cliff (and Pam) could have fight over the company. JR maybe siding with one of them to avoid that Pam (with Bobby) gets too strong... Countless possibilities.

Katherine was burned as a character when they showed her as completely deranged woman - there is no coming back from that place - they tried to redeem Julia Cumson in Falcon Crest - but it didn't work for me.

 

[stevew]

After Katherine shot Bobby and during the Dream Season after she ran him down with her car, Katherine's motives were barely discussed. Miss Ellie did wonder aloud to Pam why she hated Bobby so much. Other than that she was just dismissed as crazy. No one commented on how she fooled everyone or wondered what drove her to this insanity.
Obviously, she became a plot device so the writers weren't going to spend any time on this, but would a brief one or two episode storyline where Pam or someone did some investigating, contemplaton, or conversation on the subject to make some sense of it add the the story? After all, Pam trusted Katherine and she was her sister.

The truth is a bit dirty for Pam. Yes Katherine was mentally ill, and yes it appears it ran in Rebecca's genes, Pam just up and disappearing and Cliff in Dallas TNT - only explanation is they were mentally ill. But then there is the problem where Rebecca gave 2/3's of her estate to a brother and sister Katherine never even knew, as far as we know Herbert Wentworth never even knew about. Real world Katherine would have tied everything up in court, arguing that her mother had no right to do so with the fortune her father made long before he married Rebecca. I think with a small payout Rebecca would have won. But what Rebecca wanted was Bobby and so they made her mentally ill to explain her obsession. And no one seemed to care about this young woman's state of mental health, certainly not the brother and sister who walked away with her father's money just because they could.

 

[stevew]

The character of Katherine was similar to Lady Jessica. These characters run their course and there is hardly any coming back.

Jessica's motives were shown beautifully - grounded in family drama.
Katherine's initial resentment to Cliff getting part of her Daddy's company, her involvement with JR were fine. But in the end it was irrational and sometimes she was a cartoonist villain for no apparent reason. Her hatred for Cliff&Pam was over the top.
I would have preferred a strong Barnes/Wentworth family as a counterpart to the Ewings. Rivalry within the family but united against outsiders, like the Ewings.

They did not know what to do with Katherine at some point which was showed especially during her clueless re-appearence when Pam was in hospital.

I agree except for it was a founded hatred once they walked away with 2/3's of what was hers. In fact in the real world no doubt Herbert Wentworth's will would have prevented such. I don't have anywhere near that kind of money but I can tell you, there's no way for my wife to do such with our estate, or me to her. Taking that money was wrong. Yes, Rebecca owed them something but not 2/3's of Herbert's life work.

 

[stevew]

I agree, but I think the issue was her obsession with Bobby never felt really properly explained. It would've made more sense if at least there had been a brief time where Bobby actually led her on in some way. Add that the way Katherine was introduced to the show was as a very serious and ambitious young woman - why would she throw everything away for him? It never felt like they built up properly to it.

Agreed - that's why I said the only explanation was mental illness. Which, is a good explanation for Pam vanishing and Cliff in TNT, if they'd just mentioned such.

 

[stevew]

I totally agree, but I don’t know if they’d want to have another “challenge the will” storyline right after Miss Ellie challenged Jock’s will.

I think what they wanted was to leave it alone so that Cliff and Pamela were wealthy as well - killed the whole idea that they were not on the same level as the Ewing's kind of thing and instantly brought them up on par and that's what the writers wanted.

 

[Taylor Bennett Jr.]

Agreed - that's why I said the only explanation was mental illness. Which, is a good explanation for Pam vanishing and Cliff in TNT, if they'd just mentioned such.

I could see an argument where “repeating a parent’s terrible behavior as an adult even though you know it’s wrong” isn’t mental illness per se - it depends on the definition of the term, I guess.

 

[Taylor Bennett Jr.]

I didn’t really like the whole “Cliff and Pam magically become as wealthy as the Ewings via a long-lost, presumed-dead mother” angle, even if it led to great storylines.

A key factor in the Barnes-Ewing field was that it pitted the haves against the have-nots, and just changing it almost overnight, in something of a retcon-adjacent way, changed its nature...

Now instead of remaining a shrewd, scrappy, up-and-coming rival gunning for the big leagues, Cliff had to become a buffoonish idiot to remain a have-not. I’d like to have seen him develop some wealth in a different way, perhaps getting into the oil business via his OLM status. That would have been a high-profile position that would have opened some doors for him in a few different industries when he left the public sector.

It wouldn’t have been far-fetched for him to get there as a lawyer - a new generation Harv Smithfield or something. Imagine if he took on Ben Maxwell and some of his cronies as clients and built up a private practice around that.

I’m guessing a big factor in Cliff evolving into the “perennial loser” in his feud with JR was simply that Kercheval wasn’t tall and classically handsome like the Ewing brothers, and was also a fantastic comedic actor with a ton of range.

For all the “Cliff is a loser” talk, he sure ended up better off at the end of the series than the beginning, as opposed to JR, who in many ways was the real loser, even halfway through the series.

 

[Billy Wall]

I think what they wanted was to leave it alone so that Cliff and Pamela were wealthy as well - killed the whole idea that they were not on the same level as the Ewing's kind of thing and instantly brought them up on par and that's what the writers wanted.

Absolutely.

 

[stevew]

I could see an argument where “repeating a parent’s terrible behavior as an adult even though you know it’s wrong” isn’t mental illness per se - it depends on the definition of the term, I guess.

Not sure what you mean.