Joan Crawford: Not the Girl-Next-Door

[Snarky Oracle!]

https://tellytalk.net/attachments/1000004032-png.58753/

It's not 1906.

Joan has as many "birth years" as Pam Ewing. Crawford's birth year has been listed as 1903, 1904, 1905, 1906, and her preferred public date of 1908. And there's always "proof" that these dates are/aren't factual.

Judy Johns quotes her teacher, Nelle Sliter, "from Crawford as a client" for the date 23 March 1903 and time 10 pm.

Christina quotes another astrologer for 1904. If it is 1904, that would make Joan and Bette both Sun in Aries/Scorpio Rising/Moon in Gemini (which would make the two women even more similar than they already were).

So Crawford was even telling her astrologers two different things.

 

[Crimson]

Of course, LETTY LYNTON isn't from Crawford's Warner period. But these threads overlap.

Where's the Joan Crawford post-Silent pre-Box Office Poison MGM Era thread? I assume @ClassyCo has made one.

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

Where's the Joan Crawford post-Silent pre-Box Office Poison MGM Era thread? I assume @ClassyCo has made one.

It's beside the post-TROG thread; it features only the "Dear Joan, We're Going to Scare You to Death" episode of SIXTH SENSE and a couple of her talks show appearances, but it's important to discuss these things.

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

THE POST-TROG YEARS

I saw this when it first aired -- my mother announced that Joan Crawford was going to be on this series. (I'm not sure I knew who Crawford was in 1972, but I'd heard of her). And I remember her telling this little story to Gary Collins:

 

[ClassyCo]

Where's the Joan Crawford post-Silent pre-Box Office Poison MGM Era thread? I assume @ClassyCo has made one.

Oh, so a nod to the numerous Marilyn Monroe threads I've started?

It's beside the post-TROG thread; it features only the "Dear Joan, We're Going to Scare You to Death" episode of SIXTH SENSE and a couple of her talks show appearances, but it's important to discuss these things.

Another nod.

 

[Crimson]

Happy Mother's Day from Joan

(Crazy that there were/are people who claim she couldn't act when you see the number of emotions in her eyes in a split second.)

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

(Crazy that there were/are people who claim she couldn't act when you see the number of emotions in her eyes in a split second.)

Yes, I think one of the reasons some of Joan's performances have aged better than some of Bette's is that Bette's bitchy bravura tends to be one-note -- literally, one-note, in that Bette's vocal intonation tends to be high-pitched and nasally.

But Crawford knew, and recommended to other young actresses, that you need -- especially as a woman -- to drop your vocals down, at least here-and-there, to deeper levels in order to keep the audience listening; otherwise, 24/7 higher-pitched warbling will cause the viewer not to take you seriously.

It makes you seem more in-the-moment, more engaged. As a result, Bette Davis was often more-mannered and felt more on-automatic in a way Crawford was never really guilty.

This was also partly due to Joan's sense of being inferior to Bette (and Bette being in agreement). Joan was often trying to get Bette's approval and acknowledgement because Bette was one of the only women in Hollywood who had superior status over Joan, and Bette always rebuffed Joan for exactly the same reason.

But Bette was resting on her own laurels, sometimes phoning it in -- and phoning it in with that high-pitched nasal streak. While Crawford, goddess bless her, didn't do that.

 

[Crimson]

I recall reading someone suggest that Chaplin was unfortunate to live long enough to see his position challenged and possibly usurped by Buster Keaton; that while Chaplin's work is rooted in the Victorian era, Keaton's feels timeless and even modern.

I suppose Davis is lucky that she didn't live long enough for her and Joan's reputations reassessed.

Edit: Not that I think Davis' reputation has declined -- even if I personally think she's been overrated -- but I think Bette would be very resentful to find out Joan is no longer only seen as a glamorous dummy or a child beating monster. Davis seemed inordinately proud that her reputation was supreme. (She probably resented Hepburn's late career surge, but Kate always seemed blithely unaware of competition anyway.)

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

Speaking of Mothers' Day, I was watching a Season 6 DALLAS clip a moment ago on Facebook with Miss Ellie yelling at JR in the Southfork living room, and then I looked to my right and Bel Geddes is sobbing away in I REMEMBER MAMA on the television.

I felt a bolt of electricity and a yin-yang paradoxical duality surge and then Donna Reed screamed in the background someplace.

It was like a sign to me that Crawford should have indeed played twins, maybe twice like Bette did, where Joan would slap Cliff Barnes yet another time as she did on SECRET STORM.

Otherwise, I don't know what any of this means.


https://www.tellytalk.net/threads/the-day-mommie-dearest-beat-up-cliff-barnes.13065/

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

Joan Crawford died 49 years ago on May 10. Oddly enough, I remember the day -- and not because of her death.

 

[Crimson]

I remember the day -- and not because of her death.

Just going to leave us hanging ...

My grandmother died the same day as Bette Davis, so I always recall that day for a few reasons.

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

Just going to leave us hanging ...

Oh, I had a verbal fight with a "friend" and walked home from his house in a hyperventilating huff. Unusual, as I was an easygoing kid. (I promise). Maybe I subconsciously "knew" Joan had died and was upset about Mommie Dearest before Christina even wrote it. (Even though I believe every word of it).

Speaking of Mommie Dearest, I had another friend who gave her mother a copy of the book some 18 months later -- her mother being a Scorpio Rising/Moon in Aquarius like Joan Crawford. (But not as bad, although her daughter still hated her). She even had an old portrait of herself that her daughter thought "looks like Joan Crawford" (and it did). Her mother had a weird reaction to the Christmas gift, and she apparently never read it.

When I got away from that friendship, the daughter then re-wrote everything and decided that I had been the cause of all of her problems with all of her family members. Even though I'd had nothing to do with any of it, and she'd had all of those issues long before I was ever around, and she'd talked about it all the time. But women never lie, and their main tactic is never reputation destruction. I later found out she'd told anyone who'd listen that I was a hooker in NYC. Decades later, she contacted me through the highschool website (they always come back) and asked me if I was going to the 30th reunion. I responded nastily (kindness in dudes is viewed as weakness, as I'd learned by then) asking if she was still telling people that I was a hooker. She stammered on her keypad, laughably tried to change the subject immediately, and then tried to take the high ground. But when that didn't work, she gave up. And the conversation ended.

Bitch.

To be fair, in retrospect, I probably did look like a hooker.

My grandmother died the same day as Bette Davis, so I always recall that day for a few reasons.

Oh, no! I was at a friend's apartment whose outer wall looked out onto the pool when I heard about Davis' death. (It was still, technically, October 5 in the States).

Elizabeth Taylor died on Crawford's 108th birthday.

 

[ClassyCo]

So, the "Joan Crawford Horror Collection" includes STRAIT-JACKET and BERSERK, along with HARRIET CRAIG and QUEEN BEE. The latter two, well, they're not horror.

 

[ClassyCo]

HARRIET CRAIG has been free to watch online for quite sometime, so I finally got around to watching it this morning. Released in 1950, it falls within "the Warner Brothers era" for Crawford, even if she made it on a loan out to Columbia. I didn't know a whole lot about this movie other than it being based on a play called CRAIG'S WIFE and that the two previous film versions retained that title. Oh, and apparently, Christina Crawford and director Vincent Sherman say the character Harriet Craig was quite like the real-life Joan Crawford.

Looking at the movie, there really isn't all that much to the story. Harriet Craig (Crawford) is married to the well-to-do Walter Craig (Wendell Corey), and she's more concerned with keeping up with appearances over love and matrimony. To be blunt, Harriet is a narcissist who wants complete control over her life, the way things look, the way people in her life operate. She is manipulative, selfish, and has practically no redeeming qualities. When she finally reveals her distrust for men and her preoccupation with the "look" of her lifestyle in the film's final minutes, it's too late. If it was meant as some type of redemption for Harriet, it simply doesn't work for me. The bad seeds she's shown throughout the film, and even before the story starts, aren't easily erased. She's left alone in the house she's so desperately tried to maintain as the movie closes out.

I was in the mood today to watch a Crawford movie, and that's why I decided to watch HARRIET CRAIG. It was decent, but not my favorite of hers.

PS: the posters and advertisements try to make the film a noir, which it most definitely isn't.

 

[Crimson]

My only complaint about HARRIET CRAIG is that's around when Crawford adopted that short cropped matronly hairstyle that women of the 50s loved, and which made everyone except Liz Taylor look dowdy.

While I concede it's not a great film, it's quintessential Crawford. How much the film (and QUEEN BEE) was inspired by Joan's real personality -- or how much public perception of Joan was formed by those films -- is open to conjecture.

 

[ClassyCo]

My only complaint about HARRIET CRAIG is that's around when Crawford adopted that short cropped matronly hairstyle that women of the 50s loved, and which made everyone except Liz Taylor look dowdy.

I must say, I wasn't terribly thrown off by the hair. While it isn't a favorite hairstyle for me, at least, by the making of this movie anyway, Crawford hadn't fell into that frightening look that Christina called "hard" or "tough" or something like that. Her face is still attractive, even with all the shadows the B&W cinematographer uses to try and disguise the fact that Crawford was around 46 when this movie was made.

While I concede it's not a great film, it's quintessential Crawford. How much the film (and QUEEN BEE) was inspired by Joan's real personality -- or how much public perception of Joan was formed by those films -- is open to conjecture.

HARRIET CRAIG was alright, but I doubt I'd revisit it. QUEEN BEE, to my memory, was better and something I'd probably one day re-watch. I can see both movies offering a glimpse of the "real" Joan.

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

QUEEN BEE, to my memory, was better and something I'd probably one day re-watch. I can see both movies offering a glimpse of the "real" Joan.

The only real problem with QUEEN BEE is, at times, the unprofessionally sloppy direction (the screenwriter's directorial debut). And, perhaps, the uninspired casting of the young cousin.

 

[ClassyCo]

The only real problem with QUEEN BEE is, at times, the unprofessionally sloppy direction (the screenwriter's directorial debut). And, perhaps, the uninspired casting of the young cousin.

According to Betsy Palmer, Crawford doted on young Lucy Marlow, who played the cousin, while they were rehearsing. Crawford fussed over Marlow's wardrobe and practically took her underneath her wing. Once filming started, however, Crawford's attitude apparently changed, with Marlow later crying to Palmer that Crawford was actually slapping her instead "staging" the slap in the movie.

Who knows?

But one can see Crawford being less than kind to a younger actress. Perhaps she was disappointed that Marlow didn't have the talent she thought she did, as Palmer theorizes.

 

[Crimson]

Somehow I'm always surprised that QUEEN BEE is in B&W; why do I remember it in color? Maybe that's my problem with it; it's too far removed from the noir-ish melodramas of the 40s, but doesn't really embrace the lush melodramas of the mid-50s either.

Shame Joan didn't appear in a Douglas Sirk film. I admit I've never been wild about Jane Wyman and I'd happily swap Joan into ALL THAT HEAVEN ALLOWS.

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

No matter how young, Wyman always seemed like a middle-aged woman waiting to happen. Sure, Joan was already 90 when she left Warners, but it worked anyway.