Almost 90% of UK vaping shops sell to non-smokers

[Mel O'Drama]

Almost nine in 10 e-cigarette shops in the UK are selling vaping products to non-smokers against the industry's code of conduct, an investigation reveals.

The Royal Society for Public Health (RSPH) said 87% of shops were knowingly or unwittingly prepared to sell e-cigarettes to people who have never smoked or vaped.

Experts warn that non-smokers could become addicted if they start vaping.

The RSPH is now urging shops to keep to the voluntary code.

The organisation investigated 100 of the 1,700 specialist vape shops in England, Scotland and Wales.

Just under half of the stores did not check whether the customers had smoked before, and three-quarters of those that did still encouraged non-smokers to start vaping, the RSPH claimed.

Footage from the RSPH showed one retailer recommending a vaping liquid with 6mg nicotine content rather than 0mg, despite the customer telling him she did not smoke.

The shopkeeper said: "The nicotine does affect how much of like a hit you get at the back of your throat, so if you want a bit of that, I'd say go for a 6."

Another piece of footage showed a retailer telling a non-smoking customer he would not "want to get you hooked to something" and advising him against buying the product.

Chief executive of the RSPH, Shirley Cramer, said e-cigarettes should be treated as "evidence-based quitting aids, rather than lifestyle products", and therefore should be aimed at smokers.

She said: "We applaud the Independent British Vape Trade Association code of conduct, which is in line with this principle.

"However, as our investigation shows, the majority of vape shops in the UK are not adhering to these important standards.

"We are keen to support the sector to strengthen their codes of best practice, and for individual retailers to sign up and ultimately adhere to them."

Richard Hyslop, chief executive of the Independent British Vape Trade Association, said statistics showed the vast majority of people using e-cigarettes were ex-smokers.

"Vape products should not be marketed to non-smokers or those under the age of 18," he said.

"However, figures produced by organisations such as the Office for National Statistics and Action on Smoking and Health demonstrate that more than 90% of vapers in the UK are adult current or former smokers, therefore we do not believe this to be a significant problem."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-39523857

 

[Mel O'Drama]

What does the code of conduct say?

The Independent British Vape Trade Association represents "all responsible and ethical independent vaping businesses in the UK", both big and small.

It has a 15-point voluntary code of conduct that it asks e-cigarette shops to sign up to.

As well as calling for shops to not knowingly sell their products to under-18s, to avoid claiming health benefits from vaping and adhere to the law, it says the following:

"Vape products are for current or former smokers and existing users of vaping devices, therefore [you should] never knowingly sell to anyone who is not a current or former smoker, or a current vaper."​

 

[Mel O'Drama]

I'm very uncomfortable around vaping, which appears to be a way to keep people physically addicted to nicotine and psychologically dependent on the oral fixation habit.

I have grave doubts about the efficacy of e-cigarettes. To those that use it judiciously, for a short period, it's a lifesaver. But so many people seem to become addicted to e-cigarettes, taking a larger dosage and an increasing number of hits as time goes on, rather than weaning off them. With a good number relapsing onto smoking (or using both). In short, vaping seems to be to smoking what methodone is to heroin. There are those who view it as a socially acceptable alternative to smoking rather than a short-term treatment for nicotine addiction.

Because they're assumed to be safer than smoking to the person concerned, many people seem to think that makes them completely safe and they can top up their nicotine in places that don't allow smoking, increasing the risk to people who chose non-smoking environments for their own health.

And that's not even getting to the issue in the article... that people who have never smoked are becoming addicted to nicotine via e-cigarettes. Scary stuff.

 

[Angela Channing]

I didn't realise that vaping products could only be sold to former smokers until I heard this article on the radio today. I see so many young people (by young, I mean from about 18-25) vaping and some look way too young to have been former smokers.

I have main concerns about vaping: the vapours always have pleasant tasting flavour so people that use them don't realise it's not a pleasant product and they vape for longer than they would if it tasted of something less pleasurable. Secondly, vaping hasn't been around long enough for scientists to assess the full extent of the potential damage that it can do to health. The toxicity of smoking didn't manifest itself for decades which allowed manufacturers of cigarettes to claim their product was safe when time eventually showed it wasn't. I fear the same could be true for e-cigarettes.

 

[Mel O'Drama]

An article this morning reports that, for the first time, more than half the vapers in the country are ex-smokers.

The tone of the article suggests this is progress. Personally, I'm rather horrified that almost half the people vaping are continuing to smoke in addition. Can't say I'm that surprised though.

The cynic in me also doubts the majority of these "ex-smokers" will remain ex-smokers considering they're still addicted to nicotine.

 

[Sarah]

It turns me. These boxes that make people think it's ok to leave you in a cloud of dust behind them.

I am vehemently anti smoking. IT is disgusting. The UK is so dirty with all the butts lying everywhere. Just vile.

 

[Alexis]

How much does it cost to Vape? I cant believe it's like £10 for a pack of cigs and people still smoke. Who wants to spend £10 or £20 a day, £70 at least a week on smoking. You could do something much more pleasant like go for dinner at a nice restaurant or buy yourself a great pair of shoes or new clothes, music, get concert tickets, go to the theatre... Anything but smoke.

 

[Sarah]

If I was PM, I'd ban it. No more cigarettes. Ever.

 

[Mel O'Drama]

Now the Stoptober campaign is selling vaping as the way forward, and medical professionals are being encouraged to steer smokers towards using e-cigs...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-41339790

 

[Mel O'Drama]

Mixed messages this week. Three days ago it was reported that vaping 'can damage immune system cells'. Today we're hearing that 'relaxing e-cigarette laws would cut smoking deaths'.

Vaping may be safer than smoking - that's something we won't know for sure until decades down the line - but the safest thing of all is doing neither. If there's any risk at all from vaping (which it's proven there is) then it's insanity to expose non-smokers/non-vapers to those risks to accommodate the people who are addicted to them.

 

[Mel O'Drama]

Oh - and how vile is this picture from the second article above...

Would you let this guy anywhere near your cornet?

 

[Willie Oleson]

I didn't realise that vaping products could only be sold to former smokers

These products are aimed at (ex-) smokers, but every adult can buy them. It's not like you can't buy cigarettes if you're not a smoker.

go for dinner at a nice restaurant

Great idea! And then afterwards a nice….oh...wait.

The cynic in me also doubts the majority of these "ex-smokers" will remain ex-smokers considering they're still addicted to nicotine

A smoker will never become a non-smoker. Even after 20 years of non-smoking, that one cigarette-just-for-the-fun-of-it can make you become addicted all over again.

that people who have never smoked are becoming addicted to nicotine via e-cigarettes.

The anti-smoke brigade will go to any lenghts to create panic. That socially acceptable e-cigarette must become unacceptable too - and that's exactly what's going to happen.
It's that zero-tolerance attitude that really annoys me.

The UK is so dirty with all the butts lying everywhere.

Then don't remove all the ashtrays.

but the safest thing of all is doing neither.

That is absolutely 100% true. But smokers already know that.

 

[Alexis]

Great idea! And then afterwards a nice….oh...wait.

I mean I get it, it's addictive and a sort of comfort to those who smoke. Two of my best friends smoke, used to be three but he quit a few years ago. It's just so expensive.

Then don't remove all the ashtrays.

She means on the streets. There are places to stub out cigarettes atop of litter bins that are scattered around the big city centres. However smokers cant be bothered with going to the provided bins and just flick their butts in the street. I've noticed recently that Chewing Gum which used to be stuck all over pavements isn't as big a thing now. People seem to actually be putting that in the bins, it's just those rebellious smokers who wont be told. Despite the hefty fines if caught.

 

[Alexis]

The anti-smoke brigade will go to any lenghts to create panic. That socially acceptable e-cigarette must become unacceptable too - and that's exactly what's going to happen.
It's that zero-tolerance attitude that really annoys me.

But those vials of vape are not regulated in any way. Nobody knows what is really in them, or what potential harm they do.

 

[Willie Oleson]

Despite the hefty fines if caught.

Oops, I had no idea!

 

[Alexis]

Oops, I had no idea!

Up to £150 on the spot fine for dropping a cigarette butt.

 

[Willie Oleson]

Nobody knows what is really in them, or what potential harm they do.

If they don't know, then they shouldn't make statements like:
"that people who have never smoked are becoming addicted to nicotine via e-cigarettes"

Because if that doesn't catch on, they'll come up with something like: "could turn non-smokers into zombie-aliens".

 

[Alexis]

If they don't know, then they shouldn't make statements like:
"that people who have never smoked are becoming addicted to nicotine via e-cigarettes"

Because if that doesn't catch on, they'll come up with something like: "could turn non-smokers into zombie-aliens".

Well we know there is nicotine in them. And that nicotine is the addicting part in smoking. It's just they are made all over the world and in many different ways with different cocktails of ingredients and chemicals.

It may well be the case that in 20 years they discover that Vaping causes some strange form of cancer or any other disease. That's just it we don't know, and even if they do know we likely wont know until it's too late. Look at smoking. The perfect example, it was often promoted by doctors and dentists in early ads. And even when it was known to cause cancer it was hushed up until the evidence was totally and categorically undeniable.

I'll always remember being in hospital with a very bad case of Pneumonia at about 16 years old, it was February or March and snowing outside. I had never smoked, and yet a nurse came up to me in my bed with a wheelchair to ask if I would like to go out for a smoke. It's always been one of the most bizarre things in my life. Idiotically funny and stupid and yet totally real and true.

 

[Willie Oleson]

Well we know there is nicotine in them

Ah...I misunderstood. I thought it was about non-smokers getting addicted to the nicotine of the e-smokers.
Not that they would hesitate to use that argument.

I have no problem with rules, people should be able to live and work in a smoke-free area.
It's the interpretation of "area" that bothers me, they expect me to walk 500-1000 meters to a designated smokers-spot.

 

[Mel O'Drama]

A smoker will never become a non-smoker. Even after 20 years of non-smoking, that one cigarette-just-for-the-fun-of-it can make you become addicted all over again.

Absolutely, Willie. That's why I said "ex-smoker", because there is a difference. I'm an ex-smoker myself and I know without doubt I can't risk one hit of nicotine.

That socially acceptable e-cigarette must become unacceptable too - and that's exactly what's going to happen.
It's that zero-tolerance attitude that really annoys me.

If people want to vape, smoke, whatever then more power to them. And if people use it as a way to stop smoking then they'll eventually end up 95% healthier according to current thinking.

But I don't view e-cigs as socially acceptable either. I wouldn't want someone vaping around me on a train, in a lift, in a car, in a restaurant or coffee shop, queuing at the supermarket or any other confined space. Not while they go around exploding in peoples pockets and filling the air with unavoidable fruity vapour containing God only knows what.

That is absolutely 100% true. But smokers already know that.

Yes, but I meant that non-smokers shouldn't have to be exposed to them in communal areas.

Wanting vaping laws relaxed because they're 95% safer than cigarettes is like saying that blasting music at full volume through a speaker in public spaces is better for everyone because it's 95% safer than using headphones.

It may be 95% better for the person vaping, but the air quality is still worse for others.

Well we know there is nicotine in them. And that nicotine is the addicting part in smoking.

And that's the thing. There's one key reason why vaping has become such a big business as the tobacco industry has tailed off. It's not about health. It's about keeping the market open for a very profitable business. Addiction.

Again, though, people have every right to inhale whatever they want to so long as I don't have to.

It's just so expensive.

After my first smoke-free week I remember putting the money I would have spent on cigarettes towards some rather nice Paul Smith footwear.

However smokers cant be bothered with going to the provided bins and just flick their butts in the street.

There's a great scene in Spider-Man where a character throws his cigarette end out of his high rise office window and seconds later it gets thrown back. I've always wanted to do that to drivers who lob their dogends into the road from car windows but (a) they always seem to be doing about 40mph and (b) I'd never have the nerve.