Did Ray really need to be Jock's son?

[LMLDallas78]

then Bobby discovered it for himself.

I find it so hard to believe that Bobby never had a conversation with Ray about it. Bobby always behaved using threats or his fists.

Ray deserved some Bobby punches over that.

 

[Taylor Bennett Jr.]

I find it so hard to believe that Bobby never had a conversation with Ray about it. Bobby always behaved using threats or his fists.

Ray deserved some Bobby punches over that.

as I recall, Bobby saw Lucy hanging all over Ray at the grand opening of the Braddock Disco (the hottest event of early 1978 in the Metroplex according to Dallas-area scenesters of the time) and went over and punched him. Ray treated it like Bobby had punched him over Pam, probably the helicopter/pond/shack incident from the pilot episode - “figured I had that coming. She’s yours now all the way.” or something like that.

I’m guessing Bobby knew Lucy would act out like that at times and Ray was a bit bad himself, but didn’t want to think he’d go so far as to actually sleep with her. Pam would have explained it away as “Lucy was upset over her creepy date” and not revealed anything else to protect Lucy from the embarrassment and Ray from getting killed.

Who knows if the writers thought it through to that degree, though..

 

[LMLDallas78]

Who knows if the writers thought it through to that degree, though..

I guess at the beginning everyone was meant to be bad, that's how Dallas was sold.

 

[Taylor Bennett Jr.]

I guess at the beginning everyone was meant to be bad, that's how Dallas was sold.

now that I think of it.. Imagine if Jock found out about Ray and Lucy and had Ray killed… then years later found out Ray was his son. Now there’s some drama!

 

[LMLDallas78]

now that I think of it.. Imagine if Jock found out about Ray and Lucy and had Ray killed… then years later found out Ray was his son. Now there’s some drama!

Oh wow!! I like that.

Now that really would have been a story.

 

[Mustard]

Absolutely he was very good at showing emotion as well as showing anger and frustration being a hothead.
But Bobby was always the one "saving" people and sorting out JR's mess.
As he was Jock's favoured son (which was never hidden) I just would have liked his death to have more of an emotional impact on him. He always had to be the strong one.
I'm not knocking Patrick's acting in any way, just pointing out I wanted Bobby's reaction to be different at that time.

Bobby took Jock's death better because his relationship with his father was less complicated and complex compared to his brothers' relationship with their father. Bobby's brothers all had a certain baggage with Jock.

 

[Billy Wall]

I often wonder what punishment Ray would have received if his carrying on with Lucy had ever been found out.
Didn't Pam and Bobby know and nothing came of it?

And his one nighter with Sue Ellen although I think she would have been blamed there.

Jock AND JR would have had Ray killed and there's no way Sue Ellen would have been blamed for her one night with Ray. She was "Mrs Ewing" and one thing the Ewing's do is protect Ewing's rather they're right or wrong.

 

[LMLDallas78]

Jock AND JR would have had Ray killed and there's no way Sue Ellen would have been blamed for her one night with Ray. She was "Mrs Ewing" and one thing the Ewing's do is protect Ewing's rather they're right or wrong.

I like to think that's the case, that the family would protect "Mrs JR Ewing", but when JR found out about her and Cliff, he said if it ever came out, the family would blame it on "that tramp" he married.

Sue Ellen would perhaps have to make out Ray took advantage of her to sway the family's opinions.

They also disowned Sue Ellen when they thought she had shot JR.

Mrs JR Ewing she may have been, but as JR told her, she was easily disposable.

 

[Chris2]

They also disowned Sue Ellen when they thought she had shot JR.

The first time. And that was a logical way for the family to react. The second time, when she actually did shoot JR, she suffered no major consequences and was allowed to flounce around Southfork afterward.

 

[DallasFanForever]

I find it so hard to believe that Bobby never had a conversation with Ray about it. Bobby always behaved using threats or his fists.

Ray deserved some Bobby punches over that.

Didn’t they have a brief conversation in the next episode or am I imagining this? I thought I recall Ray asking Bobby if he was going to tell Jock and have him fired and Bobby telling him he wasn’t sure what he was going to do yet or something to that effect. I think Ray even asked Pam to persuade Bobby not to tell Jock, didn’t he?

But the incident at the disco when Bobby first finds out is the only time they had a physical altercation over it.

 

[LMLDallas78]

Didn’t they have a brief conversation in the next episode or am I imagining this?

I think you're referring to earlier in this episode when Bobby catches Ray moaning to another worker about having to take Lucy to school. Ray's worried Bobby will tell Jock.

Then it's found out Lucy is truanting and it's on Ray to make sure she gets to school. Ray tells Pam he's worried about losing his job. She says as long as he stops messing with Lucy and does his job it'll be fine. Something like that I think.

 

[Jock's Ghost]

Fourth Son is a great storyline. It brought out J.R.'s insecurities and showed us again how Ray didnt earn or fight for anything like JR did. JR was just a jealous kid. He was deprived, or so he felt, of the very thing Bobby, Ray, and even loser Gary were given freely.

Could have been interesting to see Ray be the working-class JR, underhanded, scheming, cutthroat, and an unrepentant lothario.

 

[Billy Wall]

Could have been interesting to see Ray be the working-class JR, underhanded, scheming, cutthroat, and an unrepentant lothario.

Kinda like he was in the mini-series.

 

[LMLDallas78]

Could have been interesting to see Ray be the working-class JR, underhanded, scheming, cutthroat, and an unrepentant lothario.

I would have liked Ray to be more like Jock too. Ruthless in business but not like JR.

Jock was more "there must be some skeletons there somewhere" JR said if there wasn't he would put them there. Jock's answer was "whatever".

He knew JR would do whatever he had to do.

Bobby would have threatened and punched, but would still go about things in the right way and would try not to tread on anyone.

Or I wish Ray could have gone back to being JR's sidekick like in the early days and do some of JR's dirty work for him.

 

[Billy Nolan]

I kind of felt for Steve sometimes, having to do the “shirtless wood chopping” scenes so often. Not that his physique was bad at all, but I didn’t think he was the “eye candy” or “hunk” type like Patrick, young Peter Richards, John Beck, Nicholas Pierce, etc.

Interesting aspect. Did Steve Kanaly comment on the scenes? Was it uncomfortable for him while filming it? But the scenes made him likeable in my opinion. He was the "man next door". And anyone who has ever chopped wood in the middle of summer knows that it doesn't matter whether you have a well-trained body or not. You sweat very quickly and prefer to work shirtless. (I know because I often chop wood.)

 

[LMLDallas78]

He was the "man next door".

Yes Ray wasn't really seen as a sex symbol even though he obviously was one according to most of the Ewing women. He was seen as a more rough and ready cowboy.

Ray couldn't possibly steal the thunder from Bobby.


I bet Steve enjoyed those shirtless scenes. I hope he did as I'm sure plenty of viewers did.

 

[Billy Nolan]

Yes Ray wasn't really seen as a sex symbol even though he obviously was one according to most of the Ewing women. He was seen as a more rough and ready cowboy.

Ray couldn't possibly steal the thunder from Bobby.


I bet Steve enjoyed those shirtless scenes. I hope he did as I'm sure plenty of viewers did.

I imagine Ray was some kind of "accidental sex symbol." He wasn't a polished guy like some of the typical polished soap actors. But that's probably what made him attractive to women. The guy next door.

Regarding the shirtless scenes: It was similar to Gary (Ted Shackelford) in Knots Landing. In some scenes (for example) when working on the ranch, he is said to have refrained from wearing a shirt because it was too humid during filming.
And when Steve Kanaly had to do a scene chopping wood in the heat outside, he was certainly happy that he could do it shirtless. That's quite common. I almost never wear a shirt when chopping wood in the summer. Personally, I don't care whether I look good or not. The main thing is that the work is done. (Unless there are some pretty ladies around... Then of course I flex my muscles - and suck in my stomach!)