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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Snarky Oracle!" data-source="post: 96042" data-attributes="member: 57984">I read an article yesterday about the obvious fact that the Democrats demand their accused men resign, while the Republicans just deny-deny-deny (which includes pushing that child molesting maniac Roy Moore from Alabama into congress so they can have enough votes to give those unfortunate super rich the tax breaks they desperately need).Some of the more clever rightwingers have been gleefully chortling -- and with some reason, I'm afraid -- that the leftist women are so energized by this latest warlock hunt over male sexual harassers, both in Hollywood and Washington, that they're cannibalizing their own guys (and not in a sexual way, of course) who have supported feminism in the past, those guys now suckers and targets of the women they'd helped in their equality causes, those rightwingers delighted to see the liberals meltdown from the inside, the left's men being destroyed by the left's women.And while most of us condemn sexual harassment and assault, there is indeed this current kneejerk reaction to any accusation (or obviously organized set of accusations directed at any given man) where the men must be fired with minimal (or even any) proof, and this presumption that the accused harassers are metaphors for all men and the horror that all women have faced at the hands of all men.We really don't want to make the conservatives correct about anything, but the left is comin' pretty damned close to doing that.   ----"Choosing consequences doesn’t belong to you (men) anymore.”Actress Amber Tamblyn's cleverish piece for NYT --- and she doesn't seem too concerned about false allegations against men:<a href="https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/30/opinion/im-not-ready-for-the-redemption-of-men.html" target="_blank">https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/30/opinion/im-not-ready-for-the-redemption-of-men.html</a>Amber Tamblyn: I’m Not Ready for the Redemption of MenRecently, I was sitting on my couch between two influential, Emmy-winning writers, one a man and one a woman. We were talking about consequences. The comedian Louis C.K.’s entire life seemed to have been canceled overnight. His movie wasn’t being released, and his representatives dropped him after five women accused him of sexual harassment, behavior he then admitted. In just the past week, more famous and admired men have lost their jobs for such behaviors. Enter Charlie Rose and Matt Lauer right behind him and then Garrison Keillor.The man on the couch next to me was disconcerted, making an argument that while Louis C.K.’s actions certainly merited serious consequences, what he did and what Harvey Weinstein did are two very different things. We shouldn’t lump them all together, he insisted. The woman was firm with her response: “Yes, we can and we will. Choosing consequences doesn’t belong to you anymore.”The man balked with frustration. “What do you want,” he asked her. “What’s the ultimate thing you would want to happen to him, for what he did? That he never works in this business again?” The woman said, simply: “Yes. That’s the price you pay.” The man was quiet for a moment, thinking, until he found the question he’d been looking for the entire conversation. “Tell me something: Do you believe in redemption?”It’s a valid question. But it’s also a question that makes me deeply suspicious of its timing. Why do we need to talk about the redemption of men when we are right in the middle of the salvation of women? Not even the middle, but the very beginning? Why are we obligated to care about salvaging male careers when we have just begun to tell the stories that have plagued us for lifetimes? It seems some men like a revolution only when it’s their kind of war.Throughout history, women haven’t been in a position to come forward with their stories and be taken seriously as a rule. That’s the reason we sometimes wait 20 years to report something — harassment, assault — if we say anything at all. We haven’t been silent because we forgot or made our stories up. We’ve been silent because we’ve been silenced. But women now feel comfortable telling such stories. And maybe even more important, we are seeing consequences for those actions. This is more than a watershed moment — it’s a flash-flood point.Not everyone in my industry is in support of how quickly things are moving. There’s a lot of collateral-damage dread, a cloud of unease that has covered the industry lately with talk of potentially harmful side effects of such decisive actions. What if an innocent man is falsely accused? What if the repercussion doesn’t fit the crime? What ever happened to innocent until proved guilty?That’s why the male writer wanted to talk about redemption. The idea appeals to the men I’ve been talking with, I believe, because they want a sense of normalcy restored. They want measured discussion of consequences, not swift punishment. They want us to leave poor Al Franken and his harmless grabbing alone. I’ve heard several male friends talk about text chains they are on with other men only; they describe it as a safe space to talk about how they feel in this moment. They feel afraid, disoriented and discounted. And I understand their need for such comfort and security. I am a woman. I know nothing other than needing such comfort and security, for my entire life.We’re in the midst of a reckoning. It’s what toxic masculinity’s own medicine tastes like. And people should allow the consequences to unfold, regardless of how it affects those they consider to be friends. The only way to enforce seismic, cultural change in the way men relate to women is to draw a line deep in the sand and say: This is what we will no longer tolerate. You’re either with our bodies or against our bodies. The punishment for harassment is you disappear. The punishment for rape is you disappear. The punishment for masturbation in front of us is you disappear. The punishment for coercion is you disappear.This new rule upsets many people, men and women. But what they don’t seem to understand is, no one is saying a disappearance from the public eye has to be forever. (Well, Harvey Weinstein is forever.) I’m not talking about banishment. I’m talking about ceding the floor. The power of celebrity and cultural approval must disappear for the time being so that all women see and believe that consequences do exist.In that discussion about redemption on my couch, the woman said to the man: “Look, do I believe Louis C.K. is going to come back in a year or so with a lot of reflection about what he did? Yes, I do. When he goes back out on that standup tour someday, I’ll roll my eyes and say, ‘All right, get on with it, then.’ But for now, his old power is over. He’s going to have to find a new power if he ever wants to come back.”A new power. Can there be one for men, free of humiliation, shame and violent assault against women? Women who are their wives, daughters, mothers and friends sitting next to them on couches? And what would it take to achieve it? That’s the question for men and their text chains right now, not the question of how soon they can ask about redemption. Redemption must be preceded by atonement. It is earned, not offered. If you want amends, you have to make them. You have to acknowledge the line in the sand. Once you do this, the next step is simple: Pick a side. Choose us.---Amber Tamblyn (<a href="https://twitter.com/ambertamblyn" target="_blank">@ambertamblyn</a>) is an actress, writer and director.<img src="https://www.speakertv.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/Screen-Shot-2017-10-16-at-4.29.51-PM.png" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " style="" /></blockquote>

Verification: What month follows July?