Will There Ever Be A Platform To Host Classic Soaps and ALL Their Content?

ChrisSumner

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Yes, and as Chris said the same folks who are putting The Doctors online approached P&G about putting some of those soaps online as well...only to be rejected. Back when Sony was developing SoapCity, Sony got a similar "thanks but no thanks" from them when they inquired. P&G seemed okay with licensing The Edge of Night 's final four years and Search for Tomorrow's last five years to the then-fledgling USA Network (1987-89-ish) to air in a post-primetime slot. USA did not have deep pockets back then so I'm pretty sure P&G isn't holding out for big money. I have to wonder what SoapNet offered to get P&G to allow them to license Another World for that brief period--maybe P&G and ABC/Disney were using that soap's reruns as a negotiating chip for preferential advertising rates across the channel's dayparts. Who knows?
They seemed to be open to it at some point. Remember once SOAPnet dropped the Another World reruns, they continued on Hulu, which is hard to imagine today. I remember Hulu also streamed ATWT and GL, but it was current episodes. Then of course they had the collaboration with AOL (which was 10 years too early) which gave us AW, GL, ATWT, Texas, Edge and SFT streaming. Also they did the Soap Classics DVDs! But now things have changed and for whatever stupid reason they will not consider licensing those shows.
 

Chris2

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P&G is primarily a CPG company. It realizes that there isn’t big money to be made in licensing its old soaps, so it directs its resources to the most profitable part os its business. It’s a shame that its library isn’t owned by a studio like Paramount or Warner Bros, both of which have staffs whose job it is to monetize their library content. But clearly P&G doesn’t have that, and it’s not surprising, given that its library is mostly old daytime soap operas which have relatively limited appeal today. Back when P&G licensed reruns of AW, Edge, and SFT, they were actively in the soap business, but they don’t have that kind of staff anymore.

We’re lucky that SFM - a company that specializes in older titles - has the rights to The Doctors. I doubt SFM is making a lot of money on digitizing and licensing that show to RetroTV. But Stan Moger, the co-founder of SFM, was passionate about the entertainment business and about older content and it’s more a labor of love as opposed to a business that’s going to make huge profits.
 

Monzo

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Do you think there is anyone who has actually seen every single episode of a daytime soap that is still on air? As for B&B, I think it's possible since the show started in the VCR era, but it's hard to imagine anyone who has seen every episode of General Hospital in almost 60 years.
 

Daniel Avery

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The format of soaps (especially in the older era) was such that it was not necessary to see every episode to keep up. They designed the shows to be slow-moving and repetitive not to bug the viewers, but to make it easier for housewives to keep up while also cleaning their houses, taking care of kids, and doing all the other tasks (appointments outside the home, etc.) that needed to get done. If you missed an episode (or large parts of an episode) it was not as obvious that something was amiss. So there might be many people who forget they missed an episode here or there and in fact don't have a "perfect attendance" record, even if they claim they do. There are also instances where live episodes were performed but pre-empted by news events, so everyone in the nation "missed" that episode.
 

cijimccashin

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Once Soapnet folded, the TV guide channel changed it's name to Pop, and became a mini soap network! B&B and Y&R repeated during the evening. They also started to reair Melrose Place, Dynasty and they did a special about the death of soaps called "Who shot the daytime soap?". I got rid of my cable box in 2018 so I'm not sure it they still rerun over there.

Isn't the Pluto streaming app doing something with Soap Opers?
 

Carrie Fairchild

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Honestly, the residuals for a soap I imagine wouldn't be much.
I'm not sure what the going rates are elsewhere but back in 2015 in the UK, Crossroads was due to be repeated on a new digital channel and one of the actor's (Paul Henry) complained that each actor would only get £1.25 per episode that they featured in.
 

Daniel Avery

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Once Soapnet folded, the TV guide channel changed it's name to Pop, and became a mini soap network! B&B and Y&R repeated during the evening. They also started to reair Melrose Place, Dynasty and they did a special about the death of soaps called "Who shot the daytime soap?". I got rid of my cable box in 2018 so I'm not sure it they still rerun over there.
TV Guide Channel had been Prevue Channel, which was essentially a channel that scrolled a chart of what was on all the other channels. CBS/Viacom wanted to turn it into a regular cable network (no scrolling TV listings) so re-purposing the CBS soaps and a lot of other properties on that channel made sense. Rebranding it to Pop was just the final step in its transformation. They stopped with the Y&R/B&B reruns long ago, though. I always got the impression their flirtation with soap content was Viacom's sticking their toe in the water to see if they could make a soap-centric channel, but they ultimately decided against it.

Pluto, like Pop, is owned by CBS/Viacom so I was not shocked they set up a channel just for their soaps. Being on 24/7 means they burn through three years of episodes in months. I've seen Y&R episodes as "close" as January 2020, though they might go up to the pandemic shutdown (which was about May). Given the "bare bones" way Pluto sets up these channels, I never thought it would be anything more than just these reruns. I mean, there are 1225 episode of Dark Shadows, but on their DS channel they only play episodes from around 225 to 525 in a loop.
 

Rove

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I'm not sure what the going rates are elsewhere but back in 2015 in the UK, Crossroads was due to be repeated on a new digital channel and one of the actor's (Paul Henry) complained that each actor would only get £1.25 per episode that they featured in.
As I've said previously. There are no winners in this circumstance; the actors, production houses and more importantly the viewers. I think there needs to be a new ruling which satisfies - or not - all parties. Using the general rule we have here in Australia. A business is required to keep all records for 7 years in the event they might be audited by the Australian Tax Office. I believe a similar rule should be put in place for television series. If a series is repeated within 7 years after last airing then the actors should be paid a residual. Once the 7 year mark has passed then the company responsible for producing the series is free to air it as they see fit. Otherwise we'll end up in this ridiculous situation where far too many series will be moth-balled...never to see the light of day.
 

Daniel Avery

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I like that idea, but I can hear the howls of protest already. The talent (actors, writers, directors, etc.) would demand their due, even if it's a pittance, fearing losing out on the next revolution in entertainment delivery in the same way the 1960s/1970s actors lost out on the DVD market. Any Union boss who would express support for such a plan would get tossed out of office and blackballed from the entertainment industry. And of course the studio heads and producers would be characterized as evil, money-grubbers out to swindle "the little guy" out of money they are owed, since class warfare has always been so stylish. Each side has dug in their heels, unwilling to try to update or otherwise upgrade the system because their fear of losing what they already have outweighs any optimism about getting more out of the deal.
 

tommie

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Actors with great deals would also throw all their money at preventing such a deal - noteably Friends, Big Bang Theory and The Simpsons.
 

AndyB2008

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Actors with great deals would also throw all their money at preventing such a deal - noteably Friends, Big Bang Theory and The Simpsons.
Of course with The Simpsons, the main cast (that the main 6 you see credited) went on strike unless they got a raise or share of syndication profits to the point Fox almost replaced them, or something along those lines. Harry Shearer had some pay dispute with them too.

(The voice of Homer sees it as big - not only does he write episodes with his wife, but unlike the other actors, even more well known ones than him like Kavner or Shearer, has a consulting producer credit.).



Fox could be ruthless with The Simpsons cast - see Maggie Roswell when she requested a raise to cover her airfare costs from Denver, where she lived with her husband, voice actor Hal Rayle, and their daughter, to LA. She was briefly replaced, then came back after a deal was reached to record her voice parts from Denver.
 
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Brian Kinney

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Given the "bare bones" way Pluto sets up these channels, I never thought it would be anything more than just these reruns. I mean, there are 1225 episode of Dark Shadows, but on their DS channel they only play episodes from around 225 to 525 in a loop.
They started with a loop beginning from the first episodes and expanded recently to at least episode 1010.
 

Daniel Avery

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They started with a loop beginning from the first episodes and expanded recently to at least episode 1010.
I was so excited! I mentioned in the DS thread that I dropped in randomly and got to see the episodes where Ghost Quentin chased all the Collinses (plus Maggie E) out of the mansion. The 1897 era of the show moves so incredibly fast that just peeking in once a day feels like years have passed since you last saw it. But they've already 'circled around' back to the pre-1897 era (Eve, Vampire Angelique) which tells me Pluto only wants to show 250 or so episodes at a time.

DS is available on several of these streaming channels, and I don't think the various channels would keep offering it (in light of the competition) if they didn't still get at least a few eyeballs on it. Makes me wonder if other soaps could have a similar presence in streaming if it was just offered.

So it looks like it will be up to us to create this soap opera streaming service. Maybe we can blackmail some P&G executives into letting us have reruns of their dozens of soaps. I could call Sony and pretend to be Bill Bell (they probably don't even know he's dead) and instruct them to let us have Y&R eps from 1980 onward when it expanded to an hour. There would be no commercials (hey, it's a fantasy), so the remaining eight to thirteen minutes per hour would be filled with pre-taped interviews with actors, writers, or crew members who worked on those soaps, talking about their time with those shows. There would also be a long-form interview program where notable soap opera writers past and present would discuss the medium and the whole issue of what they want to do versus what actually makes it to the screen.

Not that I've thought too deeply about it. :rolleyes:
 

ClassyCo

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The cast of Gilligan's Island used to belly-ache to anyone who would listen about how they got no residuals or anything from their show despite it having become one of the most rerun shows ever.
Had I been apart of GILLIGAN'S ISLAND, I'm sure I would've moaned some too. That show is reran as often as I LOVE LUCY and BEVERLY HILLBILLIES, but the castaways didn't have the foresight to work lengthy residuals into their contracts.​
 

Soap archives

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I wish there was I did try doing something with episodes of shows but it got taken down due to copyright. I due instant why. However I wasn't trying to make money just trying to relive the days of soap operas...
 

jillybean78

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"Complete" runs of soaps in production prior to 1980 is not something anyone ought to expect to see. Soaps of the 1950s and the first half of the 1960s went out live (rather than pre-taped). When soaps began pre-recording episodes to air later (mid-1960s), the networks "wiped" the tapes and re-used them (taped a new episode over an old one) as a regular course of action. The reason youtube only has random episodes of many pre-1970 soaps is because an occasional episode was saved for whatever reason by a viewer or some station employee. Wiping only stopped once videotape and the equipment used for recording became cheaper (late-1970s). The complete or near-complete runs of Dark Shadows, Ryan's Hope, and The Doctors only exist because the owners of the shows wished to keep copies for their own records; they eventually sold the reruns into syndication. But the majority of soaps with names we recognize would not exist in a complete run. The best we can hope for would be virtually nothing prior to 1975; spotty collections of episodes starting from roughly 1976; and consistent runs of episodes only after about 1982. It would vary, of course, since home video machines were catching on in the early-1980s and stray groups of episodes might be found and collected into a more cohesive run if people put a LOT of work into conserving/archiving the tapes. Procter and Gamble seemed to start saving some of their shows (Edge of Night, Search for Tomorrow) as early as 1978, while others from their stable didn't start until about 1980 (Another World, Texas). P&G is sitting on a large collection of soap reruns and it is a constant source of frustration to me that they rarely if ever offer up any of that collection to be viewed.

We won't even go into the issue of "rights" to air the episodes, since any service that attempts to air the episodes would need to pay licensing fees and iron out legal issues stemming from music rights, possible residual payments to actors or writers, and of course trying not to get shut down by the owners of the episodes who might not want others making money off their products.
I have had a lot of thoughts about this recently. I really wish they could make a streaming service just for soaps. If Soap Net had not been owned by ABC, it would have probably worked better/longer. But, why can't each networks streaming service show their classic shows (from the time they have recorded)? I know we have become a much smaller group, but I still think there is money on the table for these people to let us have it!
 
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