Dallas Character Bobby staying dead!

[ArchieLucasCarringtonEwing1989]

Ive been watching bits of Dallas again and I'm watching season 9, this season was really good,
I know it became known as the year "Dallas went full on Dynasty" but take that aside it was a pretty decent season.

I find usually when a major character dies in a long running series it continues to evolve the characters and develops them further and takes the series in a new direction, Chase's death in Falcon Crest did this and it did rejuvenate the series, Bobbys's death does the same in Dallas.

We get new romances in the form of Pam and Mark, Pam makes peace with Jenna and JR,
JR and Sue Ellen put the past behind them, and actually make a happy marriage, Ellie finally realises that she can't lose JR and we see that she does love him, Jack is a worthy replacement
for Bobby, and Jamie is a worthy replacement for Lucy (until she dies, which I'm quite sad about I actually though Jamie was better utilised than Lucy by this point) and we do see that Cliff and Jamie make a good pairing, Angelica Nero was camp as f**k but the show did need a new villain worse than JR.

Plus I thought the original plans for season 10 were way better than the season 10 we got in reality, Cliff swearing vengeance on JR and Jack for Jamie's death, Pam finding Mark dead in the shower and her starting a new romance with Jack, plus Mark's mysterious past which apparently caught up with him and would become a mystery for the Ewings to solve, The Wes Parmalee storyline having a proper conclusion, Pam becoming powerful more so than JR and a teen romance between Tony (Donna and Ray's adopted child) and Charlie Wade and Sue Ellen being in a wheelchair or blind.

I honestly think Dallas was much better without Bobby by this point, he didn't need to come back at all, Dallas completely reversed in development, not just by a season, but several seasons, old storylines were being repeated, actors were lost during this season (VP, Susan Howard...)
Because of the dream resolution, we may have had Pam on longer or she may have had a better ending with her, Jack and Christopher leaving Dallas at the end of s10 or ending the series at that point with Pam giving birth.

I'm sure it's been said before but I'll say it again Bobby's needless return killed Dallas in a painful death that lasted 5 years....

 

[Karin]

Pam and Mark was definitely not a new romance. They had already gone down that road in season six and seven and they were as boring in season nine as ever before. So IMHO their romance and marriage was the worst part of the entire dream season!

So I for one was thrilled when Bobby returned. I love that we got one last season of Bobby & Pam together!

Except for that though, I did love JR/SE's storyline in the dream season. Their reconciliation was better built up this season with Sue Ellen hitting rock bottom and then becoming stronger and JR seeing her with new eyes.

I also loved that Donna & Ray reconciled in the dream season. They had a good plot this season.

I completely disagree with that Jack and Jamie are good replacements for Bobby and Lucy. The Ewing cousins are not particularly interesting or charming. Even though I guess Cliff and Jamie's marriage is ok. It's nice to see Cliff happily married for a change.

I am also glad that Bobby came back since if he hadn't we'd never had Bobby & April and I really loved them as a couple too!

Also JR without Bobby was different. I loved the brother dynamics between them.

 

[Maryann]

I missed Bobby and was glad he came back. The dream season was dumb, boring and the Angelica Nero and the Jack look alike and Emerald Mine storylines were crap.

Mark (he should have stayed gone) and Pam were boring.

Jamie and Cliff were ok.

JR and Sue Ellen being happy??? Oh please, this was like a fairy tale, not the real Dallas.

Pam and JR make peace ????another fairy tale.

The only thing I liked was Ray and Donna reconciliation and hoped it was brought back after The Dream.

The show needed Bobby for the Pam and Bobby reunion (we get to see them happy even though it was for a short time and for he and JR as brothers.

I liked some parts of the season Bobby came back, the problem was the writers and producers could have done a better job with certain storylines and the departure of Pam. One of the things I disliked was the introduction of April the money hungry bitch turned whiny, needy and pathetic bitch later on. She and Bobby made a bad couple because to me he just gave in because whiny April badgered him so much and after Pam left him he just settled for what ever came along. I was glad when she was killed off good riddance.

 

[Jon Ewing Jr.]

I enjoyed the dream season. I did however like Bobby, but I never felt they should go back.

 

[Luke_Krebbs_Ewing]

I believe if Bobby hadn't returned Steve Forrest's Ben Stivers really would've been Jock Ewing.

 

[Kenny Coyote]

I found the Wes Parmalee story in very bad taste an impossible to believe. Jack was worse than Gary; whenever there was difficulty he just ran away. I certainly never missed him after he left the show. Pam running an oil company was silly; even her aerobics gym went under after a year. She had no education to prepare her for running a company that size and no experience. I think Dallas might have done better if they can't had a dream season but JR without Bobby wasn't the same.

 

[Barbara Fan]

I think Bobby returning to Dallas was the moment when many Dallas viewers felt cheated and switched off the show for good - i have friends who thought that and never followed it again.

I am one, who asides from Mz Nero and co, enjoyed the dream season and the 1st 12 episodes in particular.

I will take it over any from final seasons and was sorry John beck was written out. He was great and he could act! and he had good rapport with Vicctoria P

I also liked Pam and Mark as a couple and as much as i loved Pat D at the time, I would rather a Dallas with BBG and No pat D like S8/dream
so i was quite happy.

I was actually looking forwards to the Ben Stivers stroy but never thought he was Jock, wondered where Clayton was as he had gone missing in the last epiosde, and what happened to Sue Ellen in the explosion, could happily live with no Jamie lol

 

[Presea]

Ive been watching bits of Dallas again and I'm watching season 9, this season was really good,
I know it became known as the year "Dallas went full on Dynasty" but take that aside it was a pretty decent season.

I find usually when a major character dies in a long running series it continues to evolve the characters and develops them further and takes the series in a new direction, Chase's death in Falcon Crest did this and it did rejuvenate the series, Bobbys's death does the same in Dallas.

We get new romances in the form of Pam and Mark, Pam makes peace with Jenna and JR,
JR and Sue Ellen put the past behind them, and actually make a happy marriage, Ellie finally realises that she can't lose JR and we see that she does love him, Jack is a worthy replacement
for Bobby, and Jamie is a worthy replacement for Lucy (until she dies, which I'm quite sad about I actually though Jamie was better utilised than Lucy by this point) and we do see that Cliff and Jamie make a good pairing, Angelica Nero was camp as f**k but the show did need a new villain worse than JR.

Plus I thought the original plans for season 10 were way better than the season 10 we got in reality, Cliff swearing vengeance on JR and Jack for Jamie's death, Pam finding Mark dead in the shower and her starting a new romance with Jack, plus Mark's mysterious past which apparently caught up with him and would become a mystery for the Ewings to solve, The Wes Parmalee storyline having a proper conclusion, Pam becoming powerful more so than JR and a teen romance between Tony (Donna and Ray's adopted child) and Charlie Wade and Sue Ellen being in a wheelchair or blind.

I honestly think Dallas was much better without Bobby by this point, he didn't need to come back at all, Dallas completely reversed in development, not just by a season, but several seasons, old storylines were being repeated, actors were lost during this season (VP, Susan Howard...)
Because of the dream resolution, we may have had Pam on longer or she may have had a better ending with her, Jack and Christopher leaving Dallas at the end of s10 or ending the series at that point with Pam giving birth.

I'm sure it's been said before but I'll say it again Bobby's needless return killed Dallas in a painful death that lasted 5 years....

As much as I think that Dallas could have gone down a good path if Bobby stayed dead, there are some things that sound quite terrible about those original plans for season 10 (dvd). I always hear about this thing with Mark being dead in the shower, and it just sounds stupid and tacky to me. Why did they even bring John Beck back for one season if they were just planning to kill Mark again? To make Pam inherit even more money from rich dead people? It was getting ridiculous. I don't like the idea of Pam being with Jack. I kind of liked Jack with Jenna (she wasn't whining for once!), so why stick him with Pam and potentially start another Pam vs. Jenna thing!? I also think that the idea about Jack being the "new Bobby" is ridiculous! I may not like Bobby, but no one could replace him. Especially if that meant turning Jack into a clone of Bobby who is a whiny, self-righteous jerk with an anger problem that always messes with JR. I liked Jack because he was more easygoing. He was also something of a con man, and it would have been more fun to see him develop a good sibling-like relationship with JR and be on his side at Ewing Oil. As for the Mark mystery thing that was sort of presented in season 9 (dvd), there is no point to it if they killed him. I can't see the Ewings caring that much about it. As for Charlie developing a teenage romance with anyone? Gag me! I don't give a flip about what happens to Charlie!

 

[Presea]

I found the Wes Parmalee story in very bad taste an impossible to believe. Jack was worse than Gary; whenever there was difficulty he just ran away. I certainly never missed him after he left the show. Pam running an oil company was silly; even her aerobics gym went under after a year. She had no education to prepare her for running a company that size and no experience. I think Dallas might have done better if they can't had a dream season but JR without Bobby wasn't the same.

While I don't mind Pam working at Ewing Oil, I'll draw the line at her becoming president. Ewing Oil should only be run by JR, and Pam is not even a real Ewing. The amount of money and company owner ship stuff they kept heaping onto Pam was getting ridiculous. Especially if they had planned to give her even MORE with the whole plan of Mark dying in the shower! I've always believed that they made Katherine crazy and killed her in the dream instead of just making her do a normal exit just so that they could make Pam cash in on even more Wentworth stuff. It was ironic how Patrick Duffy's return and Victoria Principal's departure brought this whole plan of Pam being powerful for nothing.

 

[Kenny Coyote]

As much as I think that Dallas could have gone down a good path if Bobby stayed dead, there are some things that sound quite terrible about those original plans for season 10 (dvd). I always hear about this thing with Mark being dead in the shower, and it just sounds stupid and tacky to me. Why did they even bring John Beck back for one season if they were just planning to kill Mark again? To make Pam inherit even more money from rich dead people? It was getting ridiculous. I don't like the idea of Pam being with Jack. I kind of liked Jack with Jenna (she wasn't whining for once!), so why stick him with Pam and potentially start another Pam vs. Jenna thing!? I also think that the idea about Jack being the "new Bobby" is ridiculous! I may not like Bobby, but no one could replace him. Especially if that meant turning Jack into a clone of Bobby who is a whiny, self-righteous jerk with an anger problem that always messes with JR. I liked Jack because he was more easygoing. He was also something of a con man, and it would have been more fun to see him develop a good sibling-like relationship with JR and be on his side at Ewing Oil. As for the Mark mystery thing that was sort of presented in season 9 (dvd), there is no point to it if they killed him. I can't see the Ewings caring that much about it. As for Charlie developing a teenage romance with anyone? Gag me! I don't give a flip about what happens to Charlie!

Good points. I also think Dallas could have done better if they hadn't brought Bobby back, but those original plans sound terrible. Jr had to stay an extremely competent and ruthless oilman who people feared and who usually got what he wanted because of the combination of his love of the business, his intelligence, and his deviousness and ruthlessness. When they lost that, nothing else they did could have made up for the loss of the strong JR character.

 

[Presea]

Good points. I also think Dallas could have done better if they hadn't brought Bobby back, but those original plans sound terrible. Jr had to stay an extremely competent and ruthless oilman who people feared and who usually got what he wanted because of the combination of his love of the business, his intelligence, and his deviousness and ruthlessness. When they lost that, nothing else they did could have made up for the loss of the strong JR character.

Exactly!

 

[Kenny Coyote]

While I don't mind Pam working at Ewing Oil, I'll draw the line at her becoming president. Ewing Oil should only be run by JR, and Pam is not even a real Ewing. The amount of money and company owner ship stuff they kept heaping onto Pam was getting ridiculous. Especially if they had planned to give her even MORE with the whole plan of Mark dying in the shower! I've always believed that they made Katherine crazy and killed her in the dream instead of just making her do a normal exit just so that they could make Pam cash in on even more Wentworth stuff. It was ironic how Patrick Duffy's return and Victoria Principal's departure brought this whole plan of Pam being powerful for nothing.

Making Pam "powerful" by constantly having her inherit millions of dollars makes her no more fit to battle JR than winning the lottery would have made her fit to battle JR

 

[Presea]

Making Pam "powerful" by constantly having her inherit millions of dollars makes her no more fit to battle JR than winning the lottery would have made her fit to battle JR

And the worst part about it was that they probably would have made her pull a Mary Sue and magically beat JR!

 

[Michelle Stevens]

I wish he hadn't died in the first place. I think Bobby was a vital part of the show and his presence balanced JR and the Ewing family to the end.

 

[DC1888]

2/3 through my first viewing of series 9 and I have to remind myself every so often that it's a dream. Even as a first time viewer all these years later I feel cheated. Really enjoying this series which is a shame. I wish they had just faked Bobby's death and kept the storylines intact.

 

[Rove]

Jamie is a worthy replacement

I will politely disagree with you on this one. I thought introducing another blood Ewing into the mix was a good idea on paper (since we knew little about Jock Ewing's origins) however the actress playing her was mis-cast. Her introduction to Dallas and Donna Reed replacing Barbara Bel Geddes was the beginning of the end with my love affair with Dallas - and we haven't even said goodbye to Bobby or Pam yet. But, returning to the subject matter.

I thought it brave on Patrick's part to leave Dallas at a time when its popularity with the public was still high. Looking back though (and I do mention this in another post) I think Dallas producers should have banded together with the cast and crew and said we're giving Dallas two more seasons. Killing off a popular character like Bobby was brave and I firmly believe the circumstances were ripe for sending Dallas off in a blaze of glory.

At the reading of Bobby's Will, Pam is left controlling Christopher's stake in Ewing Oil. Youtube (Bobby Ewings Will) if you wish to see how the last few seasons could have played out. After Harv's final announcement of Pam controlling that interest just witness J.R.'s reaction, his glance at Pam, and her response as well. It was like the planets had aligned.

We knew Pam had it in her to take the fight to J.R. Her storming of his office after she discovers J.R. had her island hopping looking for Mark was priceless. She may not have had the business acumen of J.R. however she certainly had the wealth and inner knowledge how he operates to bring him crashing down. All our beloved characters, Miss Ellie, Clayton, Sue Ellen, Ray, Donna, Jenna could have been woven into this ultimate fight between the Ewing and Barnes family. It's how Dallas began...it's how it could have ended.

But what did we end up with? A train-wreck. A whole season written off as a bad dream. So polarizing was this even die-hard Dallas fans began to leave in droves. Awful stories, actors fresh out of high school, a J.R. that was unrecognizable. If only the producers had taken a different path we could have been left wanting more.

 

[southfork88]

Bobby Dead !

 

[Luke_Krebbs_Ewing]

I've often wondered how season ten would've played out if Patrick Duffy & Leonard Katzman had'nt have come back?

The current Dallas production team of Peter Dunne, James H. Brown & Joel Feigenbaum maybe would've stayed put & not gone over to Knots Landing, If they had stayed it's highly likely Steve Forrest's Ben Stivers really would've been Jock. It's also likely that Victoria Principal might've stayed for a few more seasons.

It's such a shame that whole season was erased largely because of Leonard Katzman. He didn't want anything to do with that ninth series as he'd been dropped from the show that year. He was billed as an Executive Consultant, in much the same way Gene Roddenberry was billed on the Star Trek movies after the disastrous Star Trek: The Motion Picture!

Mind you when the show did return with season ten & Bobby restored to life they had an opportunity to make a really compelling season. It was for a while, that whole is Wes Parmalee Jock was a great storyline but it sadly wasn't followed through. They reneged on the storyline & dropped Steve Forrest as quickly as possible. His abrupt disappearance is jarring. JR had a reasonably good storyline with getting the price of oil up & blowing up those Asian oil fields. Bobby & Pam remarried which was great, but Jenna's behaviour saw her get together with Ray which caused a bit of a rift with Bobby for a while especially when she got pregnant with his baby. Ray & Donna spent the better part of the season in an off on, mostly off relationship. I did really like Jim McMullan's Senator Andrew Dowling, that guy was a gentleman, I can see why Donna left Ray for him! That whole BD Calhoun storyline was great culminating in the Justice Department shutting down Ewing Oil. It's then bye bye to poor Pam & the conclusion of the show.

Don't get me wrong. I love Dallas season ten, it's my most watched season. I just wish Steve Forrest had stayed as Jock because that would've opened up all sorts of avenues for drama. A shame.

 

[Kenny Coyote]

Pam and Mark was definitely not a new romance. They had already gone down that road in season six and seven and they were as boring in season nine as ever before. So IMHO their romance and marriage was the worst part of the entire dream season!

So I for one was thrilled when Bobby returned. I love that we got one last season of Bobby & Pam together!

Except for that though, I did love JR/SE's storyline in the dream season. Their reconciliation was better built up this season with Sue Ellen hitting rock bottom and then becoming stronger and JR seeing her with new eyes.

I also loved that Donna & Ray reconciled in the dream season. They had a good plot this season.

I completely disagree with that Jack and Jamie are good replacements for Bobby and Lucy. The Ewing cousins are not particularly interesting or charming. Even though I guess Cliff and Jamie's marriage is ok. It's nice to see Cliff happily married for a change.

I am also glad that Bobby came back since if he hadn't we'd never had Bobby & April and I really loved them as a couple too!

Also JR without Bobby was different. I loved the brother dynamics between them.

It's been years since I've seen this thread.

Karin, you always bring an interesting perspective to your posts, enough that even without your name attached to them I'd be able to tell you wrote them.

I think a lot of people were thrilled to see Bobby return. For whatever reason, the fans who felt that way don't seem to be represented here in numbers that are proportionate. That decision to bring him back would never have been made if there hadn't been a very good sized part of the audience who would feel the same as you did. After all, nobody wants to put their show in a situation where they have to explain the return of a character they've already killed.

That they were willing to go through that much difficulty and the problems that go along with telling the audience the previous season was just a dream, gives us a measure of just how popular Patrick Duffy was in the role of Bobby Ewing. Sometimes Patrick Duffy gets blamed for the downfall of the whole series, just because the executives in control at the time offered him the opportunity to return to play what was one of the most popular roles on TV and he said yes.

If the situation had been reversed and it had been Pam who had been killed by Katherine instead of Bobby, what do you suppose the reaction would have been if they'd had Victoria Principal return to play the role of Pam and had told the audience the previous season had just been Bobby's dream? It would have been just about the same thing. The only difference is that the same people blaming Patrick Duffy for the downfall of Dallas would be blaming Victoria Principal instead.

 

[Victoriafan3]

This topic really stirs up people and their definitely seems to be a split down the middle amongst Dallas fans. Personally I love Marks return this season he was so good to - and with - Pam here. I also enjoyed Sue Ellen’s storyline aswell. Jenna became her drippiest in the dream season. Matt and his emeralds were a waste of space story but at least that was concluded and done anyway. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, apart from of course, for me, Pam’s stories, Donna and Ray this season had my favourite storyline of the entire series run. They were superb and, along with BBG back, the characters imo that kept the show grounded. Ray really evolved and grew as a character here, Steve and Susan were amazing. It was such a loss and waste of such superb writing and acting that they then just chucked all that out and Donna left :-( Unfortunately we’ll always be left with what ifs and what could have been...