Characters which should have been killed off

[Willie Oleson]

I really like this idea.

It could serve as a "have your cake and eat it" scenario. Eat it twice, actually.
-Jock returned, but since it wouldn't become official before his "second" death viewers wouldn't have to deal with a recast in the present time. If fans don't accept a different Miss Ellie then it's safe to say they won't accept a different Jock.
-the second and real death of Jock Ewing (caused by his own sons, of all people) would create a dark drama of epic proportions. Not as a plotline-o'-the-week, but something that could turn the Ewing saga completely upside down and give the series the revamp that was going to happen anyway.
Maybe there could be a sense of wanting to turn back the clock, literally and for obvious reasons, but then that happens for real when Pam is taken out of the saga and JR stumbles upon his life before Sue Ellen.
Even though Jock/Wes is not actually responsible for these events, it could have created some kind of natural flow to the narrative.

All of this wouldn't make Jock's return less far-fetched but at least it would have the aftermath this character deserved.

And if you like it very twisty then in the last episode it could be revealed that Cliff Barnes had falsified the proof that Wes was really Jock, thus ending it with yet another Big Gasp! moment.
Bobby runs upstairs to enlighten his brother (who has become clinically depressed at this point) but then....a gunshot!...it's too late. Or is it?

 

[Luke_Krebbs_Ewing]

I really like this idea. I think it’s definitely a better way to go with this storyline then the way they ended it.

You can't kill Wes.

Despite Bobby believing that Wes was Wyatt Haines all the evidence pointed to him really being Jock.

No two men can ever have identical X rays for a start. Let me be clear here, if Wes was really Wyatt Haines there's absolutely no way his X rays would've been virtually identical to Jock's. Therefore there's only one conclusion to be drawn everyone, whether you like it or not Wes Parmalee really WAS Jock Ewing all along.



Lovely actor Steve Forrest. A shame he never got to stay on Dallas as Jock Ewing.

No disrespect intended to Jim Davis but having Jock back played by Steve would've made the last four seasons so much better in my honest opinion.

 

[Billy Wall]

If Wes stayed in as Jock, what would have happened to Clayton?

 

[DallasFanForever]

No two men can ever have identical X rays for a start. Let me be clear here, if Wes was really Wyatt Haines there's absolutely no way his X rays would've been virtually identical to Jock's.

Watching at the time, I wonder how many people were aware of this? It is physically impossible for two different people to have identical X rays of their injuries, not to mention the fact that he passed a polygraph.

For a show that claims he was never supposed to be Jock, they certainly went out of their way to make it look like he possibly could be, didn’t they? I guess the X rays can be explained away by saying the writers might not have known this fact and obviously no one involved with the show had any medical knowledge. And people can bluff their way through polygraphs. It’s hard to do but it does happen as they’re not always 100% accurate.

Or maybe they just wanted everything to be left open and ambiguous so we’d still be talking about it 34 years later.

 

[lbf522]

I liked the Wes Parmalee storyline but hated how it ended like it did. Jock coming back would have made for great storylines. Its a shame the writers did not keep Garrison longer and bring on Jock's family. I would have preferred to have met Jason instead of Jamie looking for a handout and later Jack comes to town. I did like that season where Bobby was dead and it was JR and Jack.
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[Luke_Krebbs_Ewing]

Watching at the time, I wonder how many people were aware of this? It is physically impossible for two different people to have identical X rays of their injuries, not to mention the fact that he passed a polygraph.

For a show that claims he was never supposed to be Jock, they certainly went out of their way to make it look like he possibly could be, didn’t they? I guess the X rays can be explained away by saying the writers might not have known this fact and obviously no one involved with the show had any medical knowledge. And people can bluff their way through polygraphs. It’s hard to do but it does happen as they’re not always 100% accurate.

Or maybe they just wanted everything to be left open and ambiguous so we’d still be talking about it 34 years later.

As I've explained umpteen times before Wes Parmalee was really meant to be Jock Ewing.

The only reason they backpedalled and wrote him off as not being Jock was because they got cold feet as a result of a fan backlash. Mind you Bobby's resurrection in the same season didn't help matters either. With hindsight they probably shouldn't have gone ahead with the storyline again, remember it was started with Steve as Ben Stivers in season nine. Steve Forrest was still under contract, so they had to bring him back in season ten. When they did write him out they concentrated on the polygraph result, the results of the X rays weren't mentioned again.

Watch the episodes with an open mind and you'll see that right through the Steve Forrest episodes of DVD season ten he's quite clearly Jock.

 

[the-lost-son]

Wes Parma Lee was an interesting character. He had scenes with all the Ewings.

Other characters became stale because they had very limited interactions to others. For example Mandy had only interactions with JR and Sue Ellen (and Cliff) which got boring in the end. Dusty on the other hand had only interaction with JR and Sue Ellen (and Clayton) but he was never long enough around to overstay his welcome.

 

[Seaviewer]

South Fork oil might just be worth more than Ewing Oil and thus a tool to make a play for Ewing Oil.

Ooh, devious.

 

[Rove]

As I've explained umpteen times before Wes Parmalee was really meant to be Jock Ewing.

I've always wondered why it was necessary for the writers to attempt to resurrect Jock because I believe the way the character was dealt with and used to create further drama (the fight for Ewing Oil) was some of the best television ever. It's not often we see the passing of an actor be given such respect. I think that's why there was such a backlash from the viewers. We knew Jim had passed away. We all witnessed on screen how his death impacted fictional characters but how the actors stepped up their game to honour Jim.

So, I don't get the point of trying to resurrect Jock as some plot. I think it was needless...again just my opinion. It's one of the few times I've witnessed where fans were instrumental in changing the course of a story...all this prior to social media.

 

[Luke_Krebbs_Ewing]

I've always wondered why it was necessary for the writers to attempt to resurrect Jock because I believe the way the character was dealt with and used to create further drama (the fight for Ewing Oil) was some of the best television ever. It's not often we see the passing of an actor be given such respect. I think that's why there was such a backlash from the viewers. We knew Jim had passed away. We all witnessed on screen how his death impacted fictional characters but how the actors stepped up their game to honour Jim.

So, I don't get the point of trying to resurrect Jock as some plot. I think it was needless...again just my opinion. It's one of the few times I've witnessed where fans were instrumental in changing the course of a story...all this prior to social media.

Well, originally Jock's return was planned out by Peter Dunne because Bobby had just died and they needed a foil for JR. Unfortunately with Bobby's resurrection from the dead in the next season and a significant change in the production heads for season ten this particular storyline got messed around. Peter Dunne and James H. Brown who had instigated this storyline were gone and Leonard Katzman and David Paulsen were back in control. They should've buried that storyline then & there but they didn't. Steve Forrest was still under contract so they continued with the storyline. Despite the statement by Paulsen which was released years later they clearly did try to keep Forrest as Jock, also unfortunate was the news leaked whilst the season was being filmed that Steve Forrest would be playing the new Jock Ewing. Fans of Jim Davis bombarded CBS & Lorimar with complaints not to do this. I believe Lorimar then realised the negative reaction to the storyline could seriously damage the show's popularity (which at that point was still quite high) so they reneged on making him Jock and wrote Wes out asap which is why the character just disappears so abruptly. Also unfortunate was in their rush to write him out they really should've given Wes a proper resolution which they sadly didn't do. They deliberately left it ambiguous because all the evidence presented and the way the character had been written indicated Wes being Jock.

 

[GillesDenver]

Peter Dunne and James H. Brown

Peter Dunne and Joel J. Feigenbaum. James H. Brown was in "Dynasty". ;-)

 

[Luke_Krebbs_Ewing]

Peter Dunne and Joel J. Feigenbaum. James H. Brown was in "Dynasty". ;-)

You need to get your facts right.

James H. Brown was the Producer on Dallas season nine, the dream season.

 

[GillesDenver]

Oh sorry, I never realized that there was 2 different people with the same name :

James H. Brown | Writer, Script and Continuity Department, Additional Crew

Known for: The Guiding Light, All My Children, Dynasty

www.imdb.com

James H. Brown | Second Unit Director or Assistant Director, Producer, Production Manager

Known for: Marnie, The Birds, Ghost Story

www.imdb.com

That being said, James H. Brown was a producer, not a writer. Peter Dunne and Joel J. Feigenbaum were the main writers of the dream season.

 

[DallasFanForever]

I've always wondered why it was necessary for the writers to attempt to resurrect Jock because I believe the way the character was dealt with and used to create further drama (the fight for Ewing Oil) was some of the best television ever

I totally understand ur point. Jock’s death ironically led to the best years of the show. Like I said earlier, I’m one of those people that would not have had a problem with Wes/Ben turning out to be Jock but I also understand the backlash by those who did not want to see it. Jim Davis was iconic in the role and I bet a lot of long time fans were not too thrilled with the idea of resurrecting the character.

 

[Rove]

because Bobby had just died and they needed a foil for JR

I thought the obvious choice was Pam. Why make her custodian of Christopher's share in Ewing Oil if the writers weren't going to do something with it? I sometimes think Larry had a false sense he was the most important actor to Dallas. Granted he was immensely popular but so was Victoria Principle...and look what happened after her departure.

 

[pete lashmar]

I thought the obvious choice was Pam. Why make her custodian of Christopher's share in Ewing Oil if the writers weren't going to do something with it? I sometimes think Larry had a false sense he was the most important actor to Dallas. Granted he was immensely popular but so was Victoria Principle...and look what happened after her departure.

The producers and writers really missed TV gold on this. Pam was always a thorn in JR's side since day one, episode one. They had a golden opportunity to not only put Larry and Victoria centre stage, but they had the opportunity of the 2 clashing like never before. Instead they wasted their chance and came up with one of the dumbest storylines in the show's history about emerald mines...I mean sorry, whoever came out with that instead of an all out war between JR and Pam should have been sacked on the spot.

 

[DallasFanForever]

Instead they wasted their chance and came up with one of the dumbest storylines in the show's history about emerald mines.

But don’t you remember? This was Bobby’s dream! He always talked about emeralds.

 

[Luke_Krebbs_Ewing]

But don’t you remember? This was Bobby’s dream! He always talked about emeralds.

Well he did think Pam was a gem maybe that's why.

 

[the-lost-son]

During the dream season the show started to become erratic.

The 7 years prior you read/heard something about the year's Bible in which Katzman, Capice and their writers summarized the season's general outline.

During the dream season we suddenly get storylines which are leading nowhere in the end - e. g. emerald and Marinos shipping (which was agreed with Lenny Katzman although he advised a 10 episode length for the storyline).

Then Bobby is resurrected, no plan in motion for his return, all done in a hurry, the Wes Parmalee storyline (which was intriguing for me) but then forgotten after mid season without any long-lasting effect. The last consistent storyline for me is the loss of Ewing Oil, but obviously they never planned in advance how to proceed the saga. So a few episodes in season 10 (DVD11) JR gets JR Entreprises and all the assets and somehow you wonder why they had them lose Ewing Oil in the first place.

The writing is inconsistent. I wonder why things kept going downhill after the end of the 7th year. I once read that all the actors had 7-year-contracts (if the series kept going). PD wanted to leave after season 6 (DVD7) but was bound to his contract. They spiced up his character (getting shot by Katherine), but it wasn't enough to make him sign a new contract.

Maybe they had higher expenditures during the eighth year, therefor a bigger influence by Lorimar and the erratic writing/decreased longtetm planning as a result.

 

[Luke_Krebbs_Ewing]

During the dream season the show started to become erratic.

The 7 years prior you read/heard something about the year's Bible in which Katzman, Capice and their writers summarized the season's general outline.

During the dream season we suddenly get storylines which are leading nowhere in the end - e. g. emerald and Marinos shipping (which was agreed with Lenny Katzman although he advised a 10 episode length for the storyline).

Then Bobby is resurrected, no plan in motion for his return, all done in a hurry, the Wes Parmalee storyline (which was intriguing for me) but then forgotten after mid season without any long-lasting effect. The last consistent storyline for me is the loss of Ewing Oil, but obviously they never planned in advance how to proceed the saga. So a few episodes in season 10 (DVD11) JR gets JR Enterprises and all the assets and somehow you wonder why they had them lose Ewing Oil in the first place.

The writing is inconsistent. I wonder why things kept going downhill after the end of the 7th year. I once read that all the actors had 7-year-contracts (if the series kept going). PD wanted to leave after season 6 (DVD7) but was bound to his contract. They spiced up his character (getting shot by Katherine), but it wasn't enough to make him sign a new contract.

Maybe they had higher expenditures during the eighth year, therefor a bigger influence by Lorimar and the erratic writing/decreased long term planning as a result.

I think what really ruined the show apart from the dream season explanation was the departure of Victoria Principal.

Both Hagman & Duffy thought that they were Dallas. In actuality Dallas thrived when it was an ensemble show.

I don't like to say anything bad against Hagman or Duffy but with hindsight both of them thought their importance on the show was what enticed the viewers to watch. Well I'm sorry but both of them couldn't have been more wrong. The fans loved the core cast members. Dallas wasn't about JR & Bobby it was much more than that. Dallas was about the Barnes Ewing feud, Pam & Bobby and the conflict between Jock & Digger and thus Miss Ellie, JR & Cliff; with Pam & Bobby stuck in the middle.

I think Dallas suffered when the focus of the show shifted off the feud. Whilst characters like Katherine Wentworth & Mark Graison added to the drama once they were gone & Dallas reverted to being focused just on JR & Bobby that's when the rot started to set in.

As I've said Dallas was much more than just the Bobby & JR show, which unfortunately is what it became & which I believe drove the viewers away. Viewers not just fans wanted to see JR being a manipulative swine, JR's character got diluted down in the show's final seasons. The writing just wasn't as good any more & without Victoria Principal the writing was on the wall for the show's future.