What if Ben Stivers . . .

Taylor Bennett Jr.

Taylor Bennett Jr.

Telly Talk Winner
the-lost-son said:
If there was any backlash from the public to bring Jock back, it could only have stemed from the dream season. Otherwise the timeframe just doesn't add up.
Click to expand...
I have to to agree with this. If Wes had turned out to be Jock definitively, the fallout would have dominated the second half of the season. Changing their mind after the season was already underway would mean having to replan and rewrite everything after the Barbecue episode on short notice. I think that would have been a big enough development that we would have heard about it in interviews, the Curran book, etc.
 
Last edited:
D

DallasFanForever

Telly Talk Supreme
In retrospect, I think they made a mistake by saying the xrays, injuries, bullet wounds, etc were a perfect match. They were probably better off saying the injuries COULD’VE been the same person but it was inconclusive. From what I understand no two people’s xrays could be identical so they should’ve given a better explanation if they were trying to keep things ambiguous. They did a better job with the lie detector test. At the time those weren’t always known to be 100% accurate and they gave the explanation that he could pass it even if he wasn’t Jock but thought he was. So I think the ambiguity was better handled with the polygraph than it was the injuries.
 
A

ArchieLucasCarringtonEwing1989

Telly Talk TV Fanatic
I think it’s been said before, but Jock’s return would only have worked narratively speaking, had they not written off the entire 1985-86 year off as a dream, having Bobby AND Jock come back from the dead in the same season stretched credibility (and with the dream write off/Bobby back again, credibility was already stretched as it was)

Had the producers been brave and kept Bobby dead, then I think audiences might’ve been more accepting of the possibility of Jock’s return.

However this would have drastically altered the remaining five years of the show, Pam still probably would have left but under a different storyline, we would have gotten a Jock vs Clayton storyline,
JR having to get used to having his daddy around again, and his feeling conflicted, as with Miss Ellie, who would she choose?
 
Toni

Toni

Maximum Member
Via The Void said:
Just getting them now.

One part Gin, One part Yodka, three parts white lemonade with a Parasol & a cherry!

The cherry makes me think of Peter Richards! :)
Click to expand...

Nurse Hatton is offering more services now than at the time Swellin was there!! What did you give her in return, did you have anything "precious" to deal with?
 
Toni

Toni

Maximum Member
What I hate the most about this storyline is the fact they were so cocky to criticize the Dream Season because it was OTT and then, bang, all is a dream, Jock seems to be alive, women wear awful lamé gowns at OBB, and instead of a psycho like Angelica, they use a Rambo-like mercenary (and then Tommy McKay) who could pass as Angie´s soul mate. What-a-hypocrite. And they kept doing the same things in the remaining years: Kimberly, Stephanie Rogers, Sheila Foley and Lee Ann: all looked like straight out of a "Dynasty" episode.

Things Jock did and Wes didn´t:
- Smoke cigars.
- Visit Amanda.
- Say "Ewing Oil is miiiiine!"
- Mention Takapa.
- Have an affair.
- Bitch about Digger.

Not to speak of the utter coldness in Wes´s eyes. Jock had fierce eyes, not cold. There is a difference.

1659958267132.png
"Tell me if you think I´m a drunk!"
"And a slut and an inept mother!"
"Oh my Gawd, it´s you Jock!"​
 
A

ArchieLucasCarringtonEwing1989

Telly Talk TV Fanatic
Toni said:
What I hate the most about this storyline is the fact they were so cocky to criticize the Dream Season because it was OTT and then, bang, all is a dream, Jock seems to be alive, women wear awful lamé gowns at OBB, and instead of a psycho like Angelica, they use a Rambo-like mercenary (and then Tommy McKay) who could pass as Angie´s soul mate. What-a-hypocrite. And they kept doing the same things in the remaining years: Kimberly, Stephanie Rogers, Sheila Foley and Lee Ann: all looked like straight out of a "Dynasty" episode.

Things Jock did and Wes didn´t:
- Smoke cigars.
- Visit Amanda.
- Say "Ewing Oil is miiiiine!"
- Mention Takapa.
- Have an affair.
- Bitch about Digger.

Not to speak of the utter coldness in Wes´s eyes. Jock had fierce eyes, not cold. There is a difference.

View attachment 39769
"Tell me if you think I´m a drunk!"
"And a slut and an inept mother!"
"Oh my Gawd, it´s you Jock!"​
Click to expand...

This is true, for all the criticisms season 9 (DVD) gets for being too “Dynasty” and too over the top, I would say the the last five years were more outlandish than the first nine years as a whole.

It was a shame because I always preferred Dallas to Dynasty, Dynasty after season 2/3 was being outlandish and bizarre for the sole sake and purpose of beating Dallas, all Dallas had to do was keep the good and engaging storylines it had been doing for years at that point, in the end thanks to the dream, it wasn’t so much a case of Dynasty beating Dallas it was Dallas joining Dynasty in the great race to the bottom.
 
Luke_Krebbs_Ewing

Luke_Krebbs_Ewing

Telly Talk Champion
Toni said:
What I hate the most about this storyline is the fact they were so cocky to criticize the Dream Season because it was OTT and then, bang, all is a dream, Jock seems to be alive, women wear awful lamé gowns at OBB, and instead of a psycho like Angelica, they use a Rambo-like mercenary (and then Tommy McKay) who could pass as Angie´s soul mate. What-a-hypocrite. And they kept doing the same things in the remaining years: Kimberly, Stephanie Rogers, Sheila Foley and Lee Ann: all looked like straight out of a "Dynasty" episode.

Things Jock did and Wes didn´t:
- Smoke cigars.
- Visit Amanda.
- Say "Ewing Oil is miiiiine!"
- Mention Takapa.
- Have an affair.
- Bitch about Digger.

Not to speak of the utter coldness in Wes´s eyes. Jock had fierce eyes, not cold. There is a difference.

View attachment 39769
"Tell me if you think I´m a drunk!"
"And a slut and an inept mother!"
"Oh my Gawd, it´s you Jock!"​
Click to expand...


We never saw the first two on screen but when he's confronted by Bobby & JR outside JR's office as shown in the clip above (with Jim Davis's portrait behind them) he mentions Lake Takapa, so I presume Landown is in this area.


He does say at the Oil Baron's "Any of you wanting to do business with Ewing Oil the man to talk to is Me!" as shown in the above clip.

I would dispute the fact that Jock would ever bitch about Digger it was usually the other way round - Digger constantly moans about Jock.

I've been recently watching the Wes Parmalee episodes again and Steve Forrest hasn't got cold eyes, they're a piercing blue colour.

But whether he was Jock or not is subjective, I tend to go with the X ray evidence, as two different men cannot have identical X rays. For me Wes Parmalee IS Jock Ewing. :)
 
Last edited:
Taylor Bennett Jr.

Taylor Bennett Jr.

Telly Talk Winner
Via The Void said:
We never saw the first two on screen but when he's confronted by Bobby & JR outside JR's office as shown in the clip above (with Jim Davis's portrait behind them) he mentions Lake Takapa, so I presume Landown is in this area.
Click to expand...
this thing is... the lake from The Dove Hunt wasn't called Takapa at all! This might be proof that Miss Ellie was right to break the will as Jock truly was incompetent when ranting feverishly in front of the dastardly Wyatt Haines down in South America. How could he have gotten such a detail wrong??!?

jLORC74.png

NTdvYEc.png

nbvuNFv.png

(of course the town was Landowne and not 'Land Down', but I'll chalk that up to the closed captioners and not Jock's early onset dementia)
TEXakWP.png
 
Last edited:
Luke_Krebbs_Ewing

Luke_Krebbs_Ewing

Telly Talk Champion
Taylor Bennett Jr. said:
this thing is... the lake from The Dove Hunt wasn't called Takapa at all! This might be proof that Miss Ellie was right to break the will as Jock truly was incompetent when ranting feverishly in front of the dastardly Wyatt Haines down in South America. How could he have gotten such a detail wrong??!?

jLORC74.png

NTdvYEc.png

nbvuNFv.png

(of course the town was Landowne and not 'Land Down', but I'll chalk that up to the closed captioners and not Jock's early onset dementia)
TEXakWP.png
Click to expand...

The fact that Wes/Jock says this and neither Bobby or JR corrects him about it speaks volumes. So it must be true about Lake Takapa.

Maybe Landown was incorporated into the Takapa reserve since the Dove Hunt was shown or the lake was simply renamed.

JR even mentions Lake Takapa too but makes no attempt to correct this.

The obvious answer to this supposed discrepancy with the Dove Hunt episode is it was probably a continuity error.

I'm going with the option that the lake and maybe Landown itself since became a part of Takapa! :)
 
Last edited:
Taylor Bennett Jr.

Taylor Bennett Jr.

Telly Talk Winner
Via The Void said:
The fact that Wes/Jock says this and neither Bobby or JR corrects him about it speaks volumes. So it must be true about Lake Takapa.

Maybe Landown was incorporated into the Takapa reserve since the Dove Hunt was shown or the lake was simply renamed.

JR even mentions Lake Takapa too but makes no attempt to correct this.

The obvious answer to this supposed discrepancy with the Dove Hunt episode is it was probably a continuity error.

I'm going with the option that the lake and maybe Landown itself since became a part of Takapa! :)
Click to expand...
I feel like Takapa may have been closer to the Gulf than the real-life Caddo Lake (which I believe is pronounced CAD-doe rather than CAY-doe, as they had it in the show). JR was such a non-hunter that he forgot which lake they were at when he had to emerge from his mosquito net to try to save his daddy.

en.wikipedia.org

Caddo Lake - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

Well, either that or social-justice-minded powerful Dallas businessman Pat Powers had successfully pushed for a renaming, going back to the original Native name for the lake.

LaVm6Zw.png

Pat seen above at left with longtime business partner and buddy Punk Anderson

Seen below, a detailed map of Lake Takapa as Senator Bobby Ewing of Braddock County unveils his plan for what became known in political science textbooks as the Ewing Compromise of 1981. I like that there's a town called J near the northeast corner of the lake, as highway 2 meanders around nonsensically.

Pe37jAJ.png
 
Last edited:
Top