Bobby Buying And Adopting Christopher

Kenny Coyote

Telly Talk Star
These were some of the things that most distinctly highlighted the difference between the image Bobby claimed to live up to and the reality of how he lived. There was a canyon sized gap between the perception Bobby wanted people to have of him and reality.

Bobby buying Christopher wasn't so bad, but trying to keep what he thought was his own brother's baby and raise it as if it were his own? That was on the other side of the canyon between who Bobby claimed to be and reality.

JR could very easily have taken Christopher when he found out Christopher was (supposedly) his and there isn't a damn thing Bob could have done about it. JR tried to be generous though. He saw Bobby and especially Pam desperately wanted a baby and for the sake of his brother, was ready to make an incredibly generous offer. The offer was that since JR and Sue Ellen already had John Ross, but Bobby and Pam were childless, JR was going to let them raise Christopher as their own!

If JR was going to do all that for Bobby, he wanted some token of appreciation shown in return but it wasn't much - he just wanted Bobby to vote his way for the next few months until Jock's will was read. It was so little to ask for in exchange for such a huge favor, that it was really just a token request by JR for Bobby to show some gratitude and get a little something in return for all he as doing for Bobby.

Bobby's reaction was to question why he should do anything at all in return for such a magnanimous gesture! Bobby thought he was so superior to other people that he felt entitled to have people do favors like this for him without doing anything at all in return. When Jock said Bobby was spoiled rotten, he wasn't exaggerating! Bobby really didn't understand anything about a give and take relationship. Bob's idea of one was that Bob did all the taking and his brother did all the giving!

The depth of Bob's mind was shown upon finding out that unknown to any of them, Christopher wasn't JR's son. JR had certainly thought Christopher was his. When Bobby found out that Kristen had lost JR's baby, Bobby reacted by telling JR: "You're scum"! Then he punched JR. Yet somehow being willing to steal his own brother's baby is alright?

Bobby even accused JR of "blackmail." Blackmail??? No, Bob, it's called reciprocation - someone does something good for you and you do something good in return. Blackmail is: "You have to do what I want or I'll reveal something about you that will hurt you." In blackmail there is basically no choice.

Here, Bobby had all the choice in the world! JR wasn't pressuring him. He was saying, if it would mean that much to you and Pam, I'll make that sacrifice for you; I'd just like a small favor in return.

There's a saying: "No good deed does unpunished."
 
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Swami

Telly Talk Supreme
Considering Bobby doctored Christopher's birth certificate as well, he wasn't really in much of a position to be so harsh to JR.

Swami
 

Kenny Coyote

Telly Talk Star
Considering Bobby doctored Christopher's birth certificate as well, he wasn't really in much of a position to be so harsh to JR.

Swami

That’s an excellent detail! How could Bobby defend doing that? Or how about putting all that pressure in Sue Ellen to lie in court? Lying in court is perjury! It’s felony.
 

Billy Wall

Telly Talk Dream Maker
Are we forgetting that Bobby was going to give Christopher to JR before Pam came down and thought Bobby was gifting her with their adopted baby?

And are we forgetting that JR was well intent on “His” own son calling him uncle JR just along as Bobby voted his way?
 

Swami

Telly Talk Supreme
Are we forgetting that Bobby was going to give Christopher to JR before Pam came down and thought Bobby was gifting her with their adopted baby?

And are we forgetting that JR was well intent on “His” own son calling him uncle JR just along as Bobby voted his way?

At that stage it was getting very complicated!

Swami
 

Kenny Coyote

Telly Talk Star
Are we forgetting that Bobby was going to give Christopher to JR before Pam came down and thought Bobby was gifting her with their adopted baby?

All Bobby had to do was say, “No, this baby is JR and Kristen’s baby. That was such an irresponsible thing to get Pam’s hopes up by not saying that.

And are we forgetting that JR was well intent on “His” own son calling him uncle JR just along as Bobby voted his way?

I kinda doubt anyone is forgetting that since it’s what the majority of the thread starting post describes:

R could very easily have taken Christopher when he found out Christopher was (supposedly) his and there isn't a damn thing Bob could have done about it. JR tried to be generous though. He saw Bobby and especially Pam desperately wanted a baby and for the sake of his brother, was ready to make an incredibly generous offer. The offer was that since JR and Sue Ellen already had John Ross, but Bobby and Pam were childless, JR was going to let them raise Christopher as their own!

If JR was going to do all that for Bobby, he wanted some token of appreciation shown in return but it wasn't much - he just wanted Bobby to vote his way for the next few months until Jock's will was read. It was so little to ask for in exchange for such a huge favor, that it was really just a token request by JR for Bobby to show some gratitude and get a little something in return for all he as doing for Bobby.

Bobby's reaction was to question why he should do anything at all in return for such a magnanimous gesture! Bobby thought he was so superior to other people that he felt entitled to have people do favors like this for him without doing anything at all in return. When Jock said Bobby was spoiled rotten, he wasn't exaggerating! Bobby really didn't understand anything about a give and take relationship. Bob's idea of one was that Bob did all the taking and his brother did all the giving!

The depth of Bob's mind was shown upon finding out that unknown to any of them, Christopher wasn't JR's son. JR had certainly thought Christopher was his. When Bobby found out that Kristen had lost JR's baby, Bobby reacted by telling JR: "You're scum"! Then he punched JR. Yet somehow being willing to steal his own brother's baby is alright?

Bobby even accused JR of "blackmail." Blackmail??? No, Bob, it's called reciprocation - someone does something good for you and you do something good in return. Blackmail is: "You have to do what I want or I'll reveal something about you that will hurt you." In blackmail there is basically no choice.

Here, Bobby had all the choice in the world! JR wasn't pressuring him. He was saying, if it would mean that much to you and Pam, I'll make that sacrifice for you; I'd just like a small favor in return.

There's a saying: "No good deed goes unpunished."
 

CeeCee72

Telly Talk Star
Bobby's behavior in this storyline bothers me much more than JR's.

JR had a million reasons for not wanting to take on Kristen's baby, not the least of which was how Sue Ellen would react to it. Would be kinda hard to get her and John Ross back on Southfork and then say, "by the way honey, I need you to raise the baby I fathered with your sister." Yes, he used the situation to scheme. But that's to be expected from JR and what we had seen in his character.

Bobby, on the other hand lied to Pam, lied to JR, forged a birth certificate, pressured Sue Ellen to lie in court, paid cash for a human being, and then had the nerve to call JR scum.

I mean, yeah, JR was pretty scummy. But so was Bobby.
 
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Jimmy Todd

Telly Talk Mega Star
Bobby was totally wrong, but I give him some leeway because when he walked in with baby Christopher and Pam saw him, he was caught in a rough spot. Seeing the happiness on Pam's face, especially since she had tried to kill herself, got to him in that quick moment.
Once he's into the lie, it probably became easier to rationalize perpetuating the deceit.
I'm not excusing him, but I see it as a fascinating plot about how a basically good man can get caught up in doing something wrong.
 
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Kenny Coyote

Telly Talk Star
Bobby was totally wrong, but I give him some leeway because when he walked in with baby Christopher and Pam saw him, he was caught in a rough spot. Seeing the happiness on Pam's face, especially since she had tried to kill herself, got to him in that quick moment.
Once he's into the lie, it probably became easier to rationalize perpetuating the deceit.
I'm not excusing him, but I see it as a fascinating plot about how a basically good man can get caught up in doing something wrong.

It was a fascinating plot! It was exciting because if Christopher had been JR's baby as Bobby thought, JR was bound to find out eventually and then Bobby would be legally required to give Christopher to his father. Here's a question for everyone: Suppose things had proceeded that way and Bobby was legally required to give Christopher to JR. Pam would have been absolutely devastated and angry too. Do you think she'd be more angry at JR or Bobby? JR honestly didn't know Christopher was his son when Bobby brought him home. Bobby was supposed to tell JR and give him the baby but instead he gave it to Pam to make her happy.

When she first saw Christopher she asked Bobby if he was their baby and Bobby should have immediately said, "no he's not ours; he's JR and Kristin's baby." That way she wouldn't have had any time to get attached to the baby. Instead Bobby lied to make her happy, but it would have been extremely hard for her to find out Bobby lied, that he didn't adopt Christopher and that he was bringing him to JR. I imagine she'd have asked Bobby why would he risk getting her hopes up, letting her think it was their baby when it wasn't? I think she'd have been furious at Bobby for getting her hopes up in that way! What do you think?
 

Jimmy Todd

Telly Talk Mega Star
It was a fascinating plot! It was exciting because if Christopher had been JR's baby as Bobby thought, JR was bound to find out eventually and then Bobby would be legally required to give Christopher to his father. Here's a question for everyone: Suppose things had proceeded that way and Bobby was legally required to give Christopher to JR. Pam would have been absolutely devastated and angry too. Do you think she'd be more angry at JR or Bobby? JR honestly didn't know Christopher was his son when Bobby brought him home. Bobby was supposed to tell JR and give him the baby but instead he gave it to Pam to make her happy.

When she first saw Christopher she asked Bobby if he was their baby and Bobby should have immediately said, "no he's not ours; he's JR and Kristin's baby." That way she wouldn't have had any time to get attached to the baby. Instead Bobby lied to make her happy, but it would have been extremely hard for her to find out Bobby lied, that he didn't adopt Christopher and that he was bringing him to JR. I imagine she'd have asked Bobby why would he risk getting her hopes up, letting her think it was their baby when it wasn't? I think she'd have been furious at Bobby for getting her hopes up in that way! What do you think?

I agree. Pam would have hit the roof! Imagine bonding with baby Christopher for a certain cl length of time and then having to give him up? That may have destroyed their marriage.
It would have been really interesting if Christopher was JR's son and JR told Bobby to let Pam keep Christopher and that it would be their secret who the father was. JR would used that to the hilt to manipulate his brother. Of course, Bobby could have done the same to JR because he wouldn't want Sue Ellen to know about it. I wonder how long they could have run with that story.
Season 6 is my favorite season, but I also really liked season 5.
 

CeeCee72

Telly Talk Star
I agree. Pam would have hit the roof! Imagine bonding with baby Christopher for a certain cl length of time and then having to give him up? That may have destroyed their marriage.
It would have been really interesting if Christopher was JR's son and JR told Bobby to let Pam keep Christopher and that it would be their secret who the father was. JR would used that to the hilt to manipulate his brother. Of course, Bobby could have done the same to JR because he wouldn't want Sue Ellen to know about it. I wonder how long they could have run with that story.
Season 6 is my favorite season, but I also really liked season 5.

JR would have for sure told Bobby to keep him for exactly those two reasons. 1. Blackmail to get Bobby to walk away from Ewing Oil and 2. To prevent Sue Ellen (and Miss Ellie too) from finding out the truth.

It would have made a hell of a storyline. Can you imagine the blow ups when everyone finally found out the truth?
 

Kenny Coyote

Telly Talk Star
Bobby's behavior in this storyline bothers me much more than JR's.

JR had a million reasons for not wanting to take on Kristen's baby, not the least of which was how Sue Ellen would react to it. Would be kinda hard to get her and John Ross back on Southfork and then say, "by the way honey, I need you to raise the baby I fathered with your sister." Yes, he used the situation to scheme. But that's to be expected from JR and what we had seen in his character.

Bobby, on the other hand lied to Pam, lied to JR, forged a birth certificate, pressured Sue Ellen to lie in court, paid cash for a human being, and then had the nerve to call JR scum.

I mean, yeah, JR was pretty scummy. But so was Bobby.

Yeah, how who is Bobby to be judging anyone in that situation? How many crimes did he commit?

1. Buying the baby
2. Forging the birth certificate
3. Conspiring with Sue Ellen to commit perjury
4. Attempt to steal his brother's child and never let him know Christopher was his son from Kristin.

Bob does all that and has the gall to call JR scum? Really?

Bobby wanted to create the image of himself as a highly principled man but didn't want to have to live up to the image.
 
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Swami

Telly Talk Supreme
Yeah, how who is Bobby to be judging anyone in that situation? How many crimes did he commit?

1. Buying the baby
2. Forging the birth certificate
3. Conspiring with Sue Ellen to commit perjury
4. Attempt to steal his brother's child and never let him know Christopher was his son from Kristin.

Bob does all that and has the gall to call JR scum? Really?

Bobby wanted to create the image of himself as a highly principled man but didn't want to have to live up to the image.

Plus threatening to kill Farraday as well.

Swami
 

Billy Wall

Telly Talk Dream Maker
Bobby is a good man who got in over his head to a certain degree. OK, he’s not perfect. Who is? But unlike JR, Bobby isn’t going to go out of his way to destroy other people’s lives just for kicks.
 

CeeCee72

Telly Talk Star
Bobby is a good man who got in over his head to a certain degree. OK, he’s not perfect. Who is? But unlike JR, Bobby isn’t going to go out of his way to destroy other people’s lives just for kicks.

But I'm not sure JR ever went out of his way to destroy anyone's life "just for kicks" either. He ruined a lot of lives, but he always had a reason

I'm not defending him, I'm just saying both characters had a way of justifying their awful behavior in their own minds for their own reasons.
 

Billy Wall

Telly Talk Dream Maker
But I'm not sure JR ever went out of his way to destroy anyone's life "just for kicks" either. He ruined a lot of lives, but he always had a reason

I'm not defending him, I'm just saying both characters had a way of justifying their awful behavior in their own minds for their own reasons.

Did he have a reason to send Pam on a wild goose chase around the world to find Mark?

And Sue Ellen?....He wasn’t even trying to hide his infidelities.
 

CeeCee72

Telly Talk Star
Did he have a reason to send Pam on a wild goose chase around the world to find Mark?

And Sue Ellen?....He wasn’t even trying to hide his infidelities.

Sure he had a reason for sending Pam in that wild goose chase. He wanted to keep her away from Bobby. Pure and simple. I didn't say he always had a GOOD reason, just that he had a reason.

As for Sue Ellen, you're right. He didn't try to hide his affairs. But I don't think that was because he wanted to "ruin her life just for kicks." He was just selfish and mean enough not to care. In the beginning he just expected her to accept it and be a dutiful wife. As time went on, he did it I think to strike back at her for having her own affairs.
 

Kenny Coyote

Telly Talk Star
Sure he had a reason for sending Pam in that wild goose chase. He wanted to keep her away from Bobby. Pure and simple. I didn't say he always had a GOOD reason, just that he had a reason.

As for Sue Ellen, you're right. He didn't try to hide his affairs. But I don't think that was because he wanted to "ruin her life just for kicks." He was just selfish and mean enough not to care. In the beginning he just expected her to accept it and be a dutiful wife. As time went on, he did it I think to strike back at her for having her own affairs.

Also he didn't try to hide his affairs which damaged his marriage for him as much as for Sue Ellen. He wasn't trying to ruin his own marriage "for kicks" was he?

JR didn't ruin anybody's life for kicks and the only time he truly got a kick out of diminishing the quality of someone's life was when he was retaliating against Cliff for Cliff's attempts to put Ewing Oil out of business, which dates back to the fist episode.

Anyone who even attempts to take an impartial view of JR and Cliff can see that Cliff was obsessed with hurting JR and to some extent the whole Ewing family,because he talked about it incesantly and his whole life was based around interfering in JR's life. Had Cliff had the good sense to leave the Ewings alone, I have no reason to think JR would have ever gone after Cliff at all. Cliff was the initiator in the fud between JR and Cliff and JR reacted as he had to, to keep Cliff from accomplishing his objective. Who wouldn't fight back if a Cliff Barnes were trying to ruin them and their whole family?

Cliff was the one adversary were I saw JR take delight in defending himself against Cliff and making Cliff pay for his stupidity in attacking people far stronger and smarter than he. It was precisely because Cliff was so intent on hurting the Ewings that JR got a kick out of giving Cliff everything he had coming to him.
 
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Chris2

Telly Talk Dream Maker
Bobby was not a saint. Remember when he proposed to another woman (Pam) before breaking up with his other fiancée (Jenna)?
 
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