Dallas in the 90's

[Ms Southworth]

I loved how Lucas kept relevant information about his dad's whereabouts to himself, so that he (Lucas) wouldn't miss out on his beloved road trip!

Jenna is mad at Ray for not telling her his whereabouts? ... Well, I guess that he could say the same about her too! The fact that Jenna hasn't even tried to share with Ray that Lucas now knows that Ray is his dad, but not his biological father, just really bugs me!

I hope that I'll be able to accept Jenna living in Dallas for the summer! Somehow, I just have this feeling that there's going to be trouble!

Anyway, I guess that I'll have to celebrate Easter without my daily "cocktail" of your fanfic! It's not that I don't think that you deserve a break in "waitressing" us, but I'm sure going to miss it! Maybe I should spend the time reading chapter four again, so that I can give you the full review that I promised you some time ago? But maybe you forgot? Or maybe you're not interested?
Happy Easter to you and your family!

PS. I'll explain in a PM why Trevor and Lynette (to me at least) came across as "perfect"!

 

[pd fan]

:10::10: great update once again Thanks Karin!!!!!

 

[Honkytonkangel]

Jenna is mad at Ray for not telling her his whereabouts? ... Well, I guess that he could say the same about her too! The fact that Jenna hasn't even tried to share with Ray that Lucas now knows that Ray is his dad, but not his biological father, just really bugs me!

Totally agree, but then EVERYTHING about Jenna bugs me and now she's gonna get to Dallas, find Ray, throw a princess fit (must be where Charlie gets that from) about him ignoring his 'family' and whining about how hard done by she is, when she has only ever done what Jenna wants and expects everyone to fall in line.
I hope Donna gives her the Bonnie treatment if she starts any shit LOL.
Kinda cool to see a little Ewing coming out in Lucas with him not telling Donna about Ray so he'd still get his road trip.

 

[supermanfan]

You're the best! I like how you are making Jenna a caring mother even thou she did tell Lucas the dirty family secret :eck:

 

[Karin]

Thank you everyone for your feedback. All your comments are much appreciated!

Maybe I should spend the time reading chapter four again, so that I can give you the full review that I promised you some time ago? But maybe you forgot? Or maybe you're not interested?
Happy Easter to you and your family!

Thank you, Happy Easter to you and your family too!

I think re-reading episode four sounds like a great idea and of course I'm interested in reading your full review of the episode that you promised me!
In fact I'll look forward to read it.

Also who knows maybe I'll decide to give you all a treat for your Easter Eggs and start posting episode five a bit sooner than next week...

I guess it depends a little on how fast all the readers of this story catch up...

In the meantime Happy Easter Everyone!

 

[Ray&Donna]

Since I don't like Jenna and Charlie (separately or together, but especially together) it's hard for me to speak objectively about them. Lucas's little white lie was funny, though.

 

[Ms Southworth]

Since I don't like Jenna and Charlie (separately or together, but especially together) it's hard for me to speak objectively about them. Lucas's little white lie was funny, though.

I agree! Therefore, I'm already having serious doubt as to how I'm going to make an unbiased review of episode 4 for Karin! :hiding:

 

[Presea]

I don't know why, but I feel like I just can't get into the scenes with Lucy and Mitch's friends. Jenna and company are taking way too long in that hotel. I can't even keep track of how much time they have spent on this road trip anymore. Sue Ellen's jealousy at JR admiring another random woman was kind of stupid and immature, in my opinion. You would think that she would be used to it by now. And it looks even more ridiculous because she is still Mrs. Don Dorkwood, and is not even in a relationship with JR right now. If she wants JR AGAIN (after countless years of him cheating on her and subjecting her to domestic violence, I will never understand why she would go back to him), she better get used to that kind of thing from him.

 

[pd fan]

Thanks Karin Happy easter to you and your family too :danc:

 

[Ms Southworth]

Okay, I promised Karin a full review of episode 4 in Karin and Jenny's amazing fanfic! And I always keep my promises!

When Karin began posting episode 4, the fanfic had had 11,000 views! As of today, the fanfic has surpassed an astonishing 17,259 views!!! Quite an accomplishment, don't you think? Congratulations to both Karin and Jenny! :10::10::10::10::10::10::10:

When I first began reading episode 4, I was expecting it to deal a lot with the Wade's due to the episode titel, "The Wade's is back"! (English isn't my first language, but shouldn't it be "The Wade's are back"?).

It's no secret that Jenna, Charlie, and Lucas aren't my favorite characters, so I was preparing myself for "hard" times. But to my surprise, the episode only had one long scene with the Wade's (i.e. when Jenna reveals to Lucas that Ray is not his biological father), whereas the other ten Wade scenes were all rather short!

Another thing that I noticed that left me a bit puzzled, was that the "Wade's" didn't make an "appearance" in this episode until scene #9.

Initially, I thought that episode 4 would end where the "Wade's" would make their presence in Dallas known to all the Ewings, i.e. a "cliff hanger" at Southfork where Jenna would have shown up leaving everyone shocked! I was surprised that the episode ended with the Wade's living in a luxurious hotel suite and Lucas revealing his "secret"! However, I wasn't surprised that Jenna (and Charlie), once again, would end up staying in a fancy place paid for by someone else! Remember when Jenna accepted the huge monetary gift from Bobby in "Old Acquaintance" (when Maynard Andersson had "let her go")? Jenna still "fits" the picture that I have of her in my head (unfortunately)!

Even though I'm not a fan of the "Wade's", I still think that they should have been more "centerstage" in this episode, since they're mentioned in the episode titel. IMHO, the other Dallas characters managed to steal the Wade's thunder! This episode had eight long scenes, and the Wade's only were "represented" in one of the long scenes! Like I said in one of my prior comments, I think that this episode would benefit from more indepth scenes with Jenna's point of view about the years she spent with Ray in Europe. I don't think that further information about Charlie and Lucas is really necessary. Charlie doesn't really "connect" with anyone on "Dallas" except her mother, and we have already been told about the big influence that Ray has had on Lucas! Thus, it's really only Jenna's thoughts and experiences that we should have learned more about. (I guess that all these "issues" would go away, if the episode titel was changed! ).

Although the Wade's road trip seemed to go on forever and ever, I did enjoy hearing about their various sightseeing adventures. It was obvious that you as fanfic writers had taken time to study the route that they were taking and thus the sights that would be interesting to include in this fanfic. I give you lots of praises for all this hard work!

The episode had 46 scenes of which "only" eight scenes can be considered long scenes. Thus, it is clear to me now why I often felt that there were lots of short scenes without much depth! One could argue that the balance was perhaps a bit off!

Moving along to some of the other characters that were a part of episode 4:

• There were several excellent Sue Ellen and JR scenes! I especially enjoyed the scene in which JR eavesdrops on Sue Ellen while she is talking to Don on the phone. :lolo:
• This episode had several amazing family scenes at Southfork, which I really liked (and got a lot of good laughs out of). Especially the big breakfast scene in the beginning of the episode was brilliant and very "Dallas"-like).
• I loved all the Bobby and Pam scenes surrounding their reconciliation! (I was a bit surprised to read that Pam was sun tanning by the pool! On one hand, she must still have scars from her accident. On the other hand, I thought that former skin cancer patients tried to stay out of the sun, but maybe I'm completely wrong? Maybe I'm just reading too much into it, because it most certainly was a scene that very much so was like "stepping back in time" to the 80's, when the Ewing wives would relax by the pool, while the men were at work! ).
• I loved the scenes with John Ross and Christopher!
• I look forward to scenes with just Bobby/Rebecca, Ray/Margaret, and Cliff/Becky! How will these fathers explore their relationships with their daughters?
• I loved the scene in which Pam finally sits down and talks to Christopher! It was a lot shorter than I had imagined, but I think that Bobby did give Pam good advice, so that Pam let her son ask the questions and thus lead the conversation! :wink@
• I loved the scene in which Christopher and Rebecca decide to wipe the slate clean and start over! (I wish that Pam would take Christopher to L.A. and show him all the things in her house that reflects just how much connection she always tried to have with her former life in Dallas! Christopher would feel so much more loved, I imagine! ).
• The storylines with Lucy and Mitch are okay, but I hope that they will pick up "speed" in future episodes!

When you (Karin) and your sister decided to include so many characters in your fanfic, you most certainly didn't take the easy route! I can only imagine how difficult it would be to write indepth storylines for as many characters as you have taken on! Keep up the good work!

I for one am looking forward to reading the next 96 episodes!

Please start posting episode 5 real soon!

 

[Pammy P]

Great updates, cannot wait for Skank Jenna to arrive at Southfork to face off with Pam and Donna ...... yay!
Also, need a B&P update, hope bells da ring .....!!! That would be closure for me, with them driving down the fork driveway as it started ..... married! "THE END!", that is how it all should have finished, not the TNT crap!

 

[Miss Texas 1967]

Ok I am finally caught up to the "live" updates. There wasn't very much I actually had left, it just took me a while to read them.

Christopher and Pam's talk, I thought it was sweet and it gave some of the answers Christopher needed. I'm not sure I could so quickly forgive Pam for not coming back in the 7 years she's been gone though. If she wasn't well at first that's one thing, but she's absolutely fine now and just like Rebecca Wentworth she made no effort to connect to the people she had left behind once she was safely on the other side. I think she's a much better mother than Rebecca was, she did at least think of her former family and she didn't hide their existence from Rebecca (Ewing) but ehhh, it still seems like a totally crappy, selfish thing to do. How long would she have stayed away if Bobby hadn't found her?

To get in on the Pizza Hut talk, it's probably my favourite takeaway pizza. I would be the Christopher, not the Pam character in that discussion lol.

Glad to see Christopher and Rebecca communicating with each other. Now that Pam has done the right thing and explained her actions to her son he is able to relax a bit and not be so hostile toward his sister, the person he believed his mother replaced him with.

Does Margaret ever think of anything other than politics and reading? It's cute, but I feel bad for Ray, and even Rebecca for having a hard time relating to her cousin.

The talk about the sex hotline was humorous. It's nice that they can all be relaxed with each other like that.

The line about Sue Ellen's legs also made me laugh.

Lucas is a cutie Regarding Jenna and Charlie, thank goodness they've finally made it to Dallas. Jenna is in for a surprise when Ray isn't in Washington...

 

[Karin]

No update tonight I'm afraid but I figured I'd try to reply more properly to all of your feedback.

First of all thank you again for all the comments. I do appreciate that you've all taken the time to comment on my story. :thank:

Silvie, I'm glad you enjoyed the latest update. Thank you also for the Easter wishes.

Honkytonkangel, I am glad that you enjoyed seeing the Ewing emerge in Lucas. The boy is a Ewing. I guess it will be more obvious later on.
Then as for Jenna and Charlie, I agree that Charlie is definitely her mother's daughter.

Shan, I am glad that you like that Jenna is a caring mother. I think it makes sense that she is that way in our story as she was great with Charlie most of the time. Except for not telling her who her father was though...oops she's done it again!

Tommie, I am glad you enjoyed Lucas little white lie.
Then as for Jenna, maybe you would like her more if she was not married to Ray?
Because since you ship Donna & Ray, I suppose in your eyes Jenna is nothing more than an annoying obstacle standing in the way of them being together, or?

Presea, Jenna's roadtrip has come to an end. The last hotel they checked into was in Dallas!
But they are not going to stay there for long.
Then as for Sue Ellen's jealousy about JR checking in other women. It's interesting how different you can interpret the same scene since we didn't think it was jealousy when we wrote it. We thought that it was more about that she didn't want JR to pass on his macho man attitude where women are objectified to their son. She wants John Ross to be better than his father if that makes any sense?

Pammy, I get where you're coming from when you say that you want the show to end like it began with Bobby and Pam coming full circle and getting remarried again. But well since this is a very long story, we have 100 episodes, I can tell you this, the story won't end with their wedding since it will happen a lot sooner!
But yeah as for what we could see on screen, yes me too would have wanted the show to end with Bobby and Pam getting remarried again. It would have been a wonderful ending and so much better than anything we got on Dallas TNT. But yeah I wish the original show had ended with Pam & Bobby's reunion!

MissTexas1967, I am glad that you enjoyed the Chris and Pam talk. I agree that Pam shouldn't have stayed away that long but well in her mind she was doing the right thing since she didn't think that Bobby wanted her back. Of course from Christopher's POV Pam's action were wrong. She shouldn't have deprived her son of having a mom for so many years. But at least they are trying to work past that now.
Then as for if Pam would have come back if she'd never run into Bobby by accident, well I don't know. So your guess is as good as mine!
I'm glad you found some stuff humerous. Then as for Margaret her interests are going to expand a little as she starts to discover the other side of her family more. A riding lesson will be coming up soon...

Ms Southworth, first of all an extra thank you for that very detailed review of episode four. I do appreciate that you took the time to write it.
I'm glad you enjoyed how Lucas didn't want to miss out on his roadtrip and well Ray has been too busy to give Jenna much thought right now. So he still thinks they are at home in Italy. I think Jenna's anger at Ray is justified considering that he left her a note and was just gone. But yeah she should let him know she's in Dallas. But they have got their wires crossed right now!
Now as for the long review. Although the episode titles might give a hint as to what the episode will focus on I wouldn't read too much into it because we only got around to name the first 40 episodes in 1999. So originally the episodes didn't even have a title!
I think the reason episode 4 got it's title was because in our opinion the most important plot development in the episode was that the Wades arrived back in town. Also yes the title is grammarly incorrect. But hey our English has improved since we were in High School!

Then as for the disposition of the episode. It might interest you to know that a lot of the shorter scenes were added in the rewriting of it rather recently. A reason for it was because some characters weren't used much in the original disposition and we wanted them to have a bit more even "screentime" if that makes sense?

This is how episode four was originally dispositioned:


1. Bobby and Pam in the morning
2. Wades morning scene, Lucas has traded the dress for a car
3. Mario comes back to Afton
4. Ewing breakfast scene
5. John Ross and Chris talk
6. Ewing breakfast scene, Chris finds out his parents are together again
7. They arrive at Ewing Oil, talk to secretaries
8. Bobby calls Pam
9. Cliff, Afton and Becky have been to the movies
10. Pam and Christopher talk
11. Jenna, Charlie and Lucas are looking at houses
12. Jennifer Nelson calls Bobby at the office
13. Pam calls Bobby at the office, the hotline stuff
14. Ewing family dinner
15. Cliff calls Marilee, plot to ruin JR’s reputation

So as you can see it only had fifteen scenes and some characters were only used in the big family scenes. Also the scene where Jenna revealed who Lucas father was is from the original script but appeared in the end of episode three. But we retooled it a bit when we revised it.

Also when we first began writing this story these were the characters we wanted to include:

Bobby, Pam, JR, Sue Ellen, Lucy, Mitch, Cliff Barnes, Miss Ellie, Clayton, Ray, Donna, John Ross 16, Christopher 13, Afton, Rebecca 7, Ray & Donna’s Daughter Margaret 8, Cliff & Afton’s daughter Becky 10, Jenna Wade, Charlie 22 and Lucas 8.

We didn't remember the names of Margaret or Becky when we first began writing it and we added Jenna, Charlie and Lucas when we were on episode three since we were watching the early seasons of Dallas for the first time in reruns back in 1994-1996 so Jenna hadn't appeared on the show when we first began writing our story. Jenny hadn't seen the ending of the show either as she began watching it from the beginning in reruns, whereas I had watched the last four seasons of the original run in between 1991-1993 first. So that complicated our writing situation originally!

We do have a lot of characters to write for and the focus will shift a little from one episode to another which characters are at the center of the storylines. But then again so did the original show, as it really was an ensemble show with lots of wonderful characters and that was a part of its success.

In retrospect I agree with you that it would have been interesting to have more in depth flashback scenes with Jenna and her life with Ray in Italy. But we just didn't think of it when we retooled the episode. Then again I doubt most readers would want more of Jenna & Ray anyway...

I'm glad that you enjoyed the Bobby & Pam and JR/SE scenes and also the John Ross and Christopher scenes. Honestly I don't know if former skin cancer patients stays completely out fo the sun or not. The thing is that the skin cancer thing was shoed in later to explain Pam's illness in that annoying scene where Cliff tried to find her. So don't think too much about Pam as someone who is a cancer survivor. It's not a storyline that is important to this story. It was just something used to explain the mess the original Dallas left us with!

Okay that's all for tonight. An update will follow tomorrow probably...

 

[Ms Southworth]

Christopher and Pam's talk, I thought it was sweet and it gave some of the answers Christopher needed. I'm not sure I could so quickly forgive Pam for not coming back in the 7 years she's been gone though. If she wasn't well at first that's one thing, but she's absolutely fine now and just like Rebecca Wentworth she made no effort to connect to the people she had left behind once she was safely on the other side. I think she's a much better mother than Rebecca was, she did at least think of her former family and she didn't hide their existence from Rebecca (Ewing) but ehhh, it still seems like a totally crappy, selfish thing to do. How long would she have stayed away if Bobby hadn't found her? ... ...
... ... ...

The line about Sue Ellen's legs also made me laugh.

@Miss Texas 1967, Your comment about forgiveness has been popping up in my mind for several days now, so I figured that I should "speak up"! It's interesting that you (and you aren't alone, since others have commented on this earlier on) seem to have a hard time understanding how Christopher could forgive his mother (and also how Bobby forgave his ex-wife). It made me think of the behavior of some of the other characters in Karin and Jenny's fanfic, for instance, Sue Ellen and JR!

I had to go back and read a part of episode 1 again to make sure that I had my facts straight! Over the years, Sue Ellen hasn't tried much to make sure that John Ross maintained a close relationship with his father. And JR hasn't done much to try to be a father to John Ross either for years. The lack of financial resources couldn't have played a factor here, since both Sue Ellen and JR had the finances to be able to afford to send their son back and forth for visits several times a year. JR did go to England once in Karin's fanfic, but since then, he pretty much let his son "go"! I have to wonder why no one has questioned Sue Ellen and JR's behavior (since a lot of readers have had an opinion about Pam's behavior)?

Pam didn't do the "right thing" by staying away so long (and also keeping Rebecca from her dad), but Sue Ellen and JR certainly weren't perfect parents to John Ross during the same time period either, IMO! Anyone care to comment?

Oh, yes ... the line about Sue Ellen's legs also gave me a good laugh too! :lolo: Wasn't it a reference to a scene on the original show?

Ms Southworth, first of all an extra thank you for that very detailed review of episode four. I do appreciate that you took the time to write it.

:yw:

I think Jenna's anger at Ray is justified considering that he left her a note and was just gone. But yeah she should let him know she's in Dallas. But they have got their wires crossed right now!

@Karin Schill, Somehow, I've gotten the feeling by reading your fanfic (and my perception of things could certainly be wrong!) that Ray has always felt like he wasn't a part of "Jenna's family" (which, of course, consists of herself along with her two children). Yes, Ray has taken on the father role regarding Lucas, but he supposedly has never legally adopted Lucas (or maybe been allowed to by Jenna), which really must have hurt him tremendously. Thus, he has had to live with the fact that he doesn't have a legal claim regarding Lucas in any way! All this has made Ray feel like the "fourth" wheel (or should I say, "third wheel"?), instead of truly being accepted as an equal part of the family. And on top of this, I bet that he's known all along that Jenna never got over Bobby, which surely doesn't help the situation one little bit!

Yes, Ray should have told Jenna face to face that he was going to spend the summer with his daughter in the U.S. (and he should certainly have said a proper goodbye to his son), but I think that I can understand where he's coming from! :mall:

Anyway, it'll be interesting to see, if my guesses are correct, i.e. (1) that Lucas is still legally Bobby's son (in which case I really feel bad for both Lucas and Ray), and (2) that Jenna is still in love with Bobby (which, unfortunately, will only make me dislike her even more, since that would mean that she's played Ray for a fool for years then)! :bang::bang::hiding: :forgive: ... but that's just sums up how I feel about Jenna! And somehow I don't think that my opinion of her would change even if she did grant Ray a divorce!!!!!

Now as for the long review. Although the episode titles might give a hint as to what the episode will focus on I wouldn't read too much into it because we only got around to name the first 40 episodes in 1999. So originally the episodes didn't even have a title! ... ... ...
... ...
So as you can see it only had fifteen scenes and some characters were only used in the big family scenes. Also the scene where Jenna revealed who Lucas father was is from the original script but appeared in the end of episode three. But we retooled it a bit when we revised it.

So episode 4 went from only 15 scenes to 46 scenes in the re-write process???? :eck: I'm completely blown away, but in a very happy way, that is! :bravo: :10::10:

Okay that's all for tonight. An update will follow tomorrow probably...

Alright ... I'm holding my breath! :cooler: Please, please, please, please, please, please, please, PLEASE ..... start posting episode 5 today! :site:als:

 

[Karin]

Thank you Ms Southworth for sharing that with us.
I can't speak for everyone else but personally I think that Pam's relationship with Christopher and JR's relationship with John Ross are two completely different situations. The reason for it is because Pam chose to leave Christopher. For almost 8 years he didn't know where she was or even if she was still alive. John Ross on the other hand chose to move to England to live with Sue Ellen instead of JR. It was his choice not JR's. In the years while he has lived on the other side of the world JR has only visited once. But I imagine that JR still has been a presense in John Ross life in the sense that he's sent birthday gifts and Christmas gifts and they've talked on the phone. So even if John Ross and JR's relationship has grown strained during the years they have been apart they have still maintained a relationship.

Update will follow in the next post...

 

[Karin]

In a neighborhood with rather small town houses were Jenna, Charlie and Lucas out looking at one of the houses together with a female landlord. Charlie frowned when she looked at the crack in the wallpaper in the stairs. They stopped once they reached the hallway, completing their tour and the landlord asked, “Well do you like the house?”

Jenna hawked before she lied, “It seems nice.”

Charlie pulled her arm and whispered, “Mom, do you remember that house with leaking pipes and fuses going?”

“Yes I remember but we only need a place for the summer,” Jenna said.

“Yeah but still, don’t you want a house with hot water and a whole roof?”

“The roof’s broken?”

“Yeah that’s why there’s a bucket in the living room,” Charlie pointed out. “It rains in!”

Jenna made a face before turning to the landlord saying, “Thank you so much for showing us the house but we’re not really interested.”

“We’re not?” Lucas asked.

“Come here Lucas,” Jenna pulled Lucas a bit away. “I have something to tell you.”

“Sure mommy,” Lucas agreed. “What?”

“Lucas this house is really bad. Charlie discovered that there’s no hot water. The dishwasher is broken, the heater is broken. Not to talk about the broken wallpaper and above all this…it rains in! Do you see now?”

“Yes that’s bad, but I still like this house.”

Jenna looked horrified before she asked, “Why?”

“Because the wall-to-wall carpet in the living room is covered with cars!” Lucas beamed.

“Oh Lucas you would buy a dump if it’s next to the car shop!” Jenna sighed. “Honey, this house is a dump!” Jenna said seriously. “Now we’re leaving.” Jenna turned to Charlie. “Come on let’s go!”

On the way out they were stopped by the landlord, “Are you leaving already?” The landlord asked. “But this is a wonderful house.”

“Wonderful more like awful,” Charlie whispered to Lucas as they started to leave.

But in the door Lucas turned around and screamed, “Hey landlord! Wanna know why we’re leaving?”

“Lucas no…” Jenna shook her head.

“It’s okay why don’t you tell me?” The Landlord said.

“We’re leaving because this place is a dump. Charlie found out that there’s no hot water. The dishwasher is broken, the heater is broken and it rains in. But I still like it, especially your car-carpet in the living room. Can I buy that one?”

“LUCAS!” Charlie hissed.

Jenna grabbed hold of Lucas’ arm, “Kids,” Jenna smiled sheepishly. “Love your shoes by the way.”

Jenna, Charlie and Lucas then hurried to get into their rental car and Charlie said, “Mom those shoes were horrible.”

“I know,” Jenna said. “Now let’s get the hell out of here before that woman gives us a prize for that rug!” Jenna pushed the gas pedal in the bottom and the car left in haste.

 

[Mrs Bobby James Ewing]

Great updates Karin! I still love your story so much and I can't wait to find out what happens with everyone in your story. I hope Jenna and her kids are able to find a place to move into soon since they just told landlord off about the house that they just looked at in Dallas.

 

[Ms Southworth]

Hmmm, the titel of the fifth episode is interesting! Could it be that a couple of teenage sisters had a crush on "Randy" back in the day?

The opening scene was funny. Lots of problems with the town house, yet Lucas loved the carpet! However, my parents would have been mortified, if I'd behaved like Charlie and Lucas did! You just don't ever talk or whisper about such things in the presence of others! Very disrespectful! Disciplinary sanctions would definitely have been called for, if it had been me! :shy: But it is great entertainment to read about in fanfics! :lolo: And out of of all the children in this fanfic, I'm somewhat pleased that it "happened" to be Charlie and Lucas who showed such behavior!

Please update soon! :hats: :tv:

 

[Miss Texas 1967]

@Miss Texas 1967, Your comment about forgiveness has been popping up in my mind for several days now, so I figured that I should "speak up"! It's interesting that you (and you aren't alone, since others have commented on this earlier on) seem to have a hard time understanding how Christopher could forgive his mother (and also how Bobby forgave his ex-wife). It made me think of the behavior of some of the other characters in Karin and Jenny's fanfic, for instance, Sue Ellen and JR!

I had to go back and read a part of episode 1 again to make sure that I had my facts straight! Over the years, Sue Ellen hasn't tried much to make sure that John Ross maintained a close relationship with his father. And JR hasn't done much to try to be a father to John Ross either for years. The lack of financial resources couldn't have played a factor here, since both Sue Ellen and JR had the finances to be able to afford to send their son back and forth for visits several times a year. JR did go to England once in Karin's fanfic, but since then, he pretty much let his son "go"! I have to wonder why no one has questioned Sue Ellen and JR's behavior (since a lot of readers have had an opinion about Pam's behavior)?

Pam didn't do the "right thing" by staying away so long (and also keeping Rebecca from her dad), but Sue Ellen and JR certainly weren't perfect parents to John Ross during the same time period either, IMO! Anyone care to comment?

Oh, yes ... the line about Sue Ellen's legs also gave me a good laugh too! :lolo: Wasn't it a reference to a scene on the original show?

:yw:

I started responding, had to stop to go to work and then I came home and Karin had responded and I think her response is about equal to what I had in mind.

I see what you're saying, but I don't think it's the same thing. Christopher essentially grew up thinking his mother had abandoned him (and she kind of had), whereas John Ross always had one or both of his parents around and he knew they both loved him, even if they didn't love each other or couldn't live with each other. Apart from when he was very young and she went to live at the Southern Cross, Sue Ellen took his opinion into consideration every time it came to moving and she always did what was best for him. She allowed him to live at Southfork when she had custody, she asked him to move to England with her and told him she wouldn't leave if he truly couldn't bear her to leave, and the minute he decided Dallas wasn't the right choice for him, she opened her arms and welcomed him back. JR was a bit more manipulative imo, he certainly used John Ross as a bargaining chip, most memorably when he and Sue Ellen were divorced the first time and he wanted him back on Southfork, and then later when he had him hidden away in a boarding school just to spite Sue Ellen. That's all in the show's history.

Regarding the fanfic, JR definitely could have made much more of an effort to visit or even just keep in contact with his son, that's a given, but I don't think his crappy communication is anywhere near the level of abandonment. The way he treated John Ross on the show when James was around kind of emphasised JR's emotional immaturity, James was the shiny new thing who was old enough to do everything JR treasured doing the most with his own father, but John Ross while animate and excitable was not quite old enough to be in the business and everything JR was involved in. It's no excuse to shaft one child for another, especially when prior to James' appearance he was a good father, so you'd think he'd have the desire to continue to build on their relationship, but I do kind of understand how it happened. Then afterwards, where we end the show and start the story, JR basically hit emotional rock bottom and had to rebuild his life; he was no "use" to anybody for a while there, he was ill and there was a period of time where he needed to recover. Pam had the same thing, I understand her staying away while recovering if that was what was genuinely the best option, but she didn't just stay away for a few months or years, she was literally gone for seven years. JR tried to kill himself, he disappeared for a while and had to come to terms with a lot of real and perceived loss in his life (real with Jimmy, Ewing Oil, Sue Ellen, Cally & her child etc, but perceived in the sense that he had "nothing" and no reason to live anymore), but he recovered and he returned to life, he also never completely disappeared. I'm sure part of his quietness was embarrassment too, the way he treated John Ross when James was around was probably embarrassing to think about when he realised James just upped and left without really considering him, but John Ross had always wanted to be his mini-me and had really been pushed away.

I feel like there is more I could say on this topic but I'm getting myself in a bit of a muddle with show history vs fanfic storylines, so I'll wrap up with a couple of quick comments. I think Pam, and JR and Sue Ellen's actions are different, quite different. Pam just disappeared without a trace from her husband and son's lives one day, she allowed them to think she had died/been kidnapped/whatever, that was deliberate, even if she thought it was what was best at the time. Then she gave birth to Rebecca, recovered, built a "normal" life, and didn't give any real empathetic thought to the people she had left behind, namely Bobby and Christopher, but everyone else too; she compensated for her selfishness when it came to other people's lives by padding her and Rebecca's lives with bits and pieces of the past, all while she could have had the real thing if she had wanted to. Then she pops back up one day without showing too much empathy for what she put everyone through, she was more concerned about how everyone would react to her being back. For me, the million dollar question that can't be answered but would give a good indication of Pam's true state of mind is how long would she have stayed away if Bobby hadn't found her? What was she waiting for? It wasn't physical healing or until Rebecca was mature enough to hear her history, those had already happened, so what was it?
Over to JR and Sue Ellen, I don't think there was ever any doubt that they loved their son, or that John Ross knew it. He was a pawn in their games and at times there were a lot of things that seemed to take priority over what would have ultimately been best for John Ross (a stable home), but at all times there was always at least one of his parents he knew loved him, and even in the hard times he did eventually receive reassurance. JR didn't visit or call as much as he should have, that wasn't nice, but it's not unforgivable or on the same level of questionably intentioned abandonment in my opinion. Plus, John Ross doesn't take it all very seriously at all now; he either covers his real feelings with jokes, or he knows his parents well and knows bickering is just what they do and it's not worth getting all stressed out over. Regarding Sue Ellen, I think she's always been more purely intentioned, she just had a lot of deep issues that got in her way of being a good mother, however she did seek help and I don't think she's anywhere near the level of Pam (or even JR) now.

Hopefully even some of that makes sense :shy:

 

[Ray&Donna]

I'm afraid my issues with Jenna began long before they paired her with Ray--that was simply the final straw The Naldo murder mystery and trial received far too much screen time, at the expense of the rest of the cast. Her living it up at Southfork as Bobby's "widow" leading to a nervous breakdown was a low point of the dream season. Then Ray limiting his empathy for his wife in favor of another pregnant woman who presented a better image of domesticity with a ready-made family...needless to say, by the time of her utterly-depressing wedding to Ray, I was more than done with the character and the show.