Dallas Couples JR & Sue Ellen - Swoonalicious Appreciation Thread

[Miss Texas 1967]

JR's intent to marry Kimberly was the same as his intent to do a lot of things where other people were concerned, he strung her along with no intent to follow through with his plan, simply planning to swoop in and take control of what he was really there for before he had to go through with it.

He was naive enough to believe that despite Sue Ellen's character development she was still the same mild mannered lady, prepared to look the other way even if it tore her up inside, ready to welcome him back when he paid attention to her again. This time she wasn't.

Sue Ellen spent years developing, growing, changing and becoming stronger, she didn't need JR the way she had in the early years, she had her own fortune, her own life and confidence to go out on her own if need be.

JR planned things to go a certain way but those plans backfired on him in a way he didn't expect. Kimberly's father died prematurely, Sue Ellen didn't divorce him, and when he went in for Weststar he was not the only interested party. JR was cocky in expecting he would always come out on top, he got that way because usually that's exactly how things were, not this time though.

 

[Sarah]

JR's intent to marry Kimberly was the same as his intent to do a lot of things where other people were concerned, he strung her along with no intent to follow through with his plan, simply planning to swoop in and take control of what he was really there for before he had to go through with it.

He was naive enough to believe that despite Sue Ellen's character development she was still the same mild mannered lady, prepared to look the other way even if it tore her up inside, ready to welcome him back when he paid attention to her again. This time she wasn't.

Sue Ellen spent years developing, growing, changing and becoming stronger, she didn't need JR the way she had in the early years, she had her own fortune, her own life and confidence to go out on her own if need be.

JR planned things to go a certain way but those plans backfired on him in a way he didn't expect. Kimberly's father died prematurely, Sue Ellen didn't divorce him, and when he went in for Weststar he was not the only interested party. JR was cocky in expecting he would always come out on top, he got that way because usually that's exactly how things were, not this time though.

Thank you Miss T that is exactly what I thought. And is worded perfectly. What troubles me though is, okay we all agree he loved her, but why did he want a divorce so badly - and if SHE HAD divorced him - how would he have solved that problem????

 

[Justine]

I have to be honest, there are certain seasons I don't remember very well, mainly season 7 and season 10 onward until Linda's exit (because I have never watched any further episodes after Sue Ellen left). I vaguely remember the Kimberly Cryder storyline but not well enough to identify motivation. Probably, it would have been like you said that J.R. expected her to fall apart and they could reconcile once he had dealt with business.

 

[Sarah]

I'm all about the leaving after Sue Ellen left. I didn't. And have mental scars because of it. (as you can probably tell!! Disclaimer: Love you Dallas.)

 

[Miss Texas 1967]

Thank you Miss T that is exactly what I thought. And is worded perfectly. What troubles me though is, okay we all agree he loved her, but why did he want a divorce so badly - and if SHE HAD divorced him - how would he have solved that problem????

He wanted a divorce not because he wanted a divorce but because Kimberly put a marriage to her as a condition on handing over her shares (or her father's or whatever they were). JR saw the divorce as a means to an end. That's why I say he never really intended to marry her, he didn't want to and he was working away in the background to get the shares without her assistance, going to her father directly (to which she hated him for in the end because Dr Styles died while he was there trying to convince him to sign the paperwork).

The only benefit in JR actually divorcing Sue Ellen would be that it would be easier to get what he wanted. In order to keep Sue Ellen though he should have been transparent with her. His secrecy only hurt them in the end.

 

[Miss Texas 1967]

I have a question for everyone, food for thought more than JR/SE reality.

Sue Ellen told Bobby she married the wrong brother. Bobby and Sue Ellen were much closer in age than JR and Sue Ellen. The entire show would have been much different if they had met first. The question is, say a young Bobby brings a young Sue Ellen home to Southfork, a younger JR takes notice. Do we think he was above trying to steal his brother's girl for himself? How does Sue Ellen react?

 

[southfork88]

 

[Crazy For Sue Ellen]

I have a question for everyone, food for thought more than JR/SE reality.

Sue Ellen told Bobby she married the wrong brother. Bobby and Sue Ellen were much closer in age than JR and Sue Ellen. The entire show would have been much different if they had met first. The question is, say a young Bobby brings a young Sue Ellen home to Southfork, a younger JR takes notice. Do we think he was above trying to steal his brother's girl for himself? How does Sue Ellen react?

Funny I wrote a story about Sue Ellen meeting Bobby first, and JR tries to steal her away.

 

[Miss Texas 1967]

Funny I wrote a story about Sue Ellen meeting Bobby first, and JR tries to steal her away.

Sounds about right lol

Is this story available to read anywhere?

 

[Sarah]

Nooooooooooo he'd have stolen her. Yes, I'm all for this. STEAL HER STEAL HER!!!! (No Afton song please, tramp!!!)

About the age thing - I remember reading somewhere that there are 7 years between JR and Sue Ellen - 9 years between Linda and Larry. Is 7 years accurate to everyone?

PS @Miss Texas 1967 - thank you for answering my question so succintly. It means a lot as this storyline is currently MELTING my head.

I have another question!!! I've been watching the storyline where she reveals to him that she is behind Valentines. He is SO impressed and not at all concerned about 'The Thing' ie Winger). So why did it take them so long to make a move on the other?? It's clear that she wants him, by how she looks at him during the big reveal, and he gives her a seductive look up and down - and smiles at her from the doorway. The timing isn't great as he is preoccupied with WestStar and with Parmalee - and for some reason ARGH - sleeps with April in the middle of it all. But you can see them gradually moving closer together, standing closer, being closer in each others company during this time. Does anyone else notice this or have I finally went over the edge?! @Miss Texas 1967 @zephiey @Crazy For Sue Ellen @Justine ???

 

[Crazy For Sue Ellen]

Sounds about right lol

Is this story available to read anywhere?

No. I'd have to re-post it if you would like.

 

[Miss Texas 1967]

No. I'd have to re-post it if you would like.

Yes please

 

[Miss Texas 1967]

Nooooooooooo he'd have stolen her. Yes, I'm all for this. STEAL HER STEAL HER!!!! (No Afton song please, tramp!!!)

About the age thing - I remember reading somewhere that there are 7 years between JR and Sue Ellen - 9 years between Linda and Larry. Is 7 years accurate to everyone?

PS @Miss Texas 1967 - thank you for answering my question so succintly. It means a lot as this storyline is currently MELTING my head.

I have another question!!! I've been watching the storyline where she reveals to him that she is behind Valentines. He is SO impressed and not at all concerned about 'The Thing' ie Winger). So why did it take them so long to make a move on the other?? It's clear that she wants him, by how she looks at him during the big reveal, and he gives her a seductive look up and down - and smiles at her from the doorway. The timing isn't great as he is preoccupied with WestStar and with Parmalee - and for some reason ARGH - sleeps with April in the middle of it all. But you can see them gradually moving closer together, standing closer, being closer in each others company during this time. Does anyone else notice this or have I finally went over the edge?! @Miss Texas 1967 @zephiey @Crazy For Sue Ellen @Justine ???

Sue Ellen was born in 1947 if the pageant video was correct in saying she was 20 years old in 1967.
JR is a little less clear depending on where you get the info, the Early Years movie has him born around 1936/1937, TNT Dallas has his grave showing 1939, but this screenshot has him born 1934 so who knows. At the least 8 years and at the most 13 but I think it was closer to 8.

You may have picked up the number 7 from the beginning of the show where JR and Sue Ellen have been married for 7 years, it's mentioned in passing regarding their lack of children if I recall correctly. Though 7 could just as easily be the number of years between them, the show really wasn't that clear.

Regarding the second question, I would have to rewatch the entire season to get a feel of the timing again. My only guess would be they often had a sort of shy, flirty thing going before they reunited again. They sort of had the same thing later on when Calhoun was taunting the family, they danced around their attraction for a while before reuniting.

 

[Crazy For Sue Ellen]

Yes please

Ok I will post soon.

 

[Sarah]

Wow thank you @Miss Texas 1967 - I know I'm alive with the questions at the minute!!!

Parts of the document interestingly shows a lack of continuity as in the dream it says JR's blood type is 0.

I love reading these documents - makes them seem truer to life. I will have to remember where I read the '7' - it's come from somewhere, maybe one of the Dallas books....

Thanks for the comments about the flirtation. Very sexy. Very sexy indeed and I agree. I just wish he hadn't slept with April in the middle of it.

 

[Justine]

I'm curious about what you all think occurred in the years between Dallas and Dallas TNT - I haven't seen the nineties' films, so I tend not to think of them as canon. I'm also about to watch TNT season 2 for the second time, so some of my questions may be answered but...

1. When do you think Sue Ellen divorced Don and returned to Dallas?

2. Was J.R. in his chair of depression for the whole twenty years? If not, did he and Sue Ellen interact when she returned? If yes, do you think she visited him?

3. What do you think occurred in the years between the end of the series and its 2012 reboot?

 

[Miss Texas 1967]

I'm curious about what you all think occurred in the years between Dallas and Dallas TNT - I haven't seen the nineties' films, so I tend not to think of them as canon. I'm also about to watch TNT season 2 for the second time, so some of my questions may be answered but...

1. When do you think Sue Ellen divorced Don and returned to Dallas?

2. Was J.R. in his chair of depression for the whole twenty years? If not, did he and Sue Ellen interact when she returned? If yes, do you think she visited him?

3. What do you think occurred in the years between the end of the series and its 2012 reboot?

I think the movies actually offer a decent amount of filler between the years. They aren't great by any means but it is nice to see the original cast back and they are written by writers who were there for the original show (Leonard Katzman and Arthur Bernard Lewis) so it's not completely non-canon.

Regarding the questions I tend to think in relation to the movies because they do give some insight into the lives of the Ewings after the show and there's a little bit to grab onto.

1. In the first movie Sue Ellen and John Ross are living in England but John Ross quickly lets it slip to JR that Sue Ellen and Don are basically no more. So I'd say that's about accurate. Don was fine I guess, his worst personality most certainly comes out in fanfic rather than what we got in the actual show. Post-Don there was little reason for Sue Ellen to be in England so I'd say she returned to Dallas soon after that.

2. This is more of a TNT question about a plot I can't say I was that fond of to begin with so I'm not sure. I think Sue Ellen calmed and matured as she got older and out of love, compassion or even just curiosity yes she would have visited him. Was it not revealed at some point in the TNT show that JR was sort of faking his quiet depression? I thought I remembered a scene where he talks to John Ross like a normal person and says Bobby's an idiot or something. I haven't rewatched the show for a while and it shows lol

3. Going back to the movies I think they ended in a way that sets up a future we can imagine without having to be shown. Bobby and Sue Ellen own Ewing Oil in one of the movies, then Bobby resigns from the oil business and sells his part back to Sue Ellen, meanwhile JR is working his way back into Sue Ellen's good books and it's not a stretch to imagine they would be working together soon enough. In the first movie Afton, Cliff and Pamela Rebecca are all shown as a sort of happy family and it's no secret who Pamela Rebecca is so if they counted the movies as canon at all the TNT show would be missing a big plot (I always thought it was dumb Christopher wouldn't recognise his cousin, it's not like he and Cliff weren't close ish and Cliff was hiding his daughter). It's not unrealistic to imagine the boys (John Ross and Christopher) would follow the plan set out for them either, ranching or oil, whatever they chose. I think the TNT show would have worked much better had they started with an established structure like the original did rather than having the adult characters acting like teenagers.

 

[Sarah]

I'm curious about what you all think occurred in the years between Dallas and Dallas TNT - I haven't seen the nineties' films, so I tend not to think of them as canon. I'm also about to watch TNT season 2 for the second time, so some of my questions may be answered but...

1. When do you think Sue Ellen divorced Don and returned to Dallas?

2. Was J.R. in his chair of depression for the whole twenty years? If not, did he and Sue Ellen interact when she returned? If yes, do you think she visited him?

3. What do you think occurred in the years between the end of the series and its 2012 reboot?

Great questions and thank you for keeping the discussion going!!! I have seen the movies so DO count them. However hopefully my answers will cover with movies and without.

When I saw that JR Returns was on the shelf in my local video store (yes a video store, long before the widespread use of the internet!!) I almost collapsed. I was with my first boyfriend at the time and was trying to be all cool, but my love for Dallas had never went away. When I lifted the cassette and LINDA GRAY AND LARRY HAGMAN were on the back, I almost peed myself. It was all too much. I didn't know a thing about it coming back and I had to wait until my boyfriend was out of the way (he was an asshole and with hindsight not worth the hassle!) and I went back and rented it. The video store were lucky to get it back as I rented it for days...and days...and days.....

I'll try and answer your questions as I see them, but not sure if it will be from Sarah's fantasy world of JR and Sue Ellen or if it's 'realistic' answers - so here goes.

1. JR Returns was made in 1996 - but there is no reference to it BEING 1996 when Sue Ellen and John Ross fly home from London. Sue Ellen had left Dallas in 1989 with Dallas ending in 1991. I find it hard to believe in my head that they had NO contact for 7 years. So I think she went to England but that the marriage to Don didn't last anymore than a year/year and a half at best. As you say, she would have had no reason to stay in England other than to stay as far away from JR as she had said she wanted to. But I don't think she did want to and likely came back around 1992 when she believed JR had been killed. This would give time to team up with Bobby etc and make her own life. **Just a reference within JR Returns that I want to point out. When John Ross tells her that JR has been killed in a car accident, Sue Ellen says 'Not my baby...my God....'. These are her words. Another poster a long time ago thought she was saying 'No my baby' (to John Ross). She isn't. She's referring to JR as her baby. I know Linda Gray well enough to know what she was saying!!!!


2. I don't believe JR was in the depressed state for 20 years. Although the shooting of himself is cleared up by Bobby saying he shot the mirror, and JR probably did need some form of counselling/mental health help afterwards, given all the crap he'd pulled, I don't think he was there for 20 years. I don't think JR could sit still for 20 years, unless we are to believe he was TOTALLY defeated. I do believe Sue Ellen leaving had a MASSIVE impact on him which was hard to come back from, but it's hard to tie the movies together with TNT because of continuity. So I like to think somewhere between JR Returns and TNT, that he just couldn't survive with things the way they were with Sue Ellen - he couldn't live without her as his wife and couldn't handle what had become of him in business, so he did go a bit mad. However, as much as I do believe he needed help and a rest, the home we see in TNT is also JR's way of making everyone feel sorry for him.

3. This one is a tough one. If the movies are included, JR and Sue Ellen slept together when she returned to Dallas after she thought he was killed in the car accident. But then he STUPIDLY went and started messing around with that cheap hag Anita. I don't understand why JR and Sue Ellen weren't together in War of the Ewings. I don't get it. It didn't make sense to me that Sue Ellen would live at Southfork and not be with JR as his partner or wife. JR did try to make a move on her in WOTE, but she wasn't having it. However it is very clear the love is still there when he stops her from being hurt by McKay's henchman and she runs to rip open his shirt when she thinks he's been shot (oh my!!!)

What I LIKE to believe happened prior to 2012 was that they were living very closely with Sue Ellen having her own independence at her own house, running a business that has nothing to do with oil, and that JR and her have a close and friendly relationship and that the flame between them is still very much lit. He looks out for her and he's made it clear how stupid he was and that he wants her back. I'd like to think they maybe started to see each other again but that she refuses to marry him. JR is doing his best to show her he's changed for good. I never liked that they made Sue Ellen go into the oil business - it's not who Sue Ellen is. She would be much better being like a fashion executive, having her own life. As much as I want her with JR, I do not like that the writers made her so resentful in the end. Had she walked away and not made the movie, got WestStar etc - they would have been back together and all our questions (hopes prayers and dreams!!!!) would have been answered!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


I hope that makes sense. I'll probably add more later.

 

[Sarah]

I'm sad. I just read some fanfic about JR having a daughter with that thing. Well I didn't read it, I just noticed it. I really don't believe JR ever would have left our Sue Ellen for Mandy. My mojo has officially went on strike.

 

[Alexia]

I'm sad. I just read some fanfic about JR having a daughter with that thing. Well I didn't read it, I just noticed it. I really don't believe JR ever would have left our Sue Ellen for Mandy. My mojo has officially went on strike.

I understand Sarah!!!! I can't stand fanfics that ship JR/Mandy or JR/Katherine either...:fist: