Pam's mummy debacle - was this a dig at Victoria?

[southfork88]

Victoria Principal and Linda Gray deserved a salary equal to that of Patrick Duffy. Larry Hagman for several reasons had a salary not comparable to other actors.

 

[Luke_Krebbs_Ewing]

Victoria Principal and Linda Gray deserved a salary equal to that of Patrick Duffy. Larry Hagman for several reasons had a salary not comparable to other actors.

It's not right that the women stars were valued less than the male stars because Victoria Principal, Linda Gray and Susan Howard made the show so watchable.

Barbara Bel Geddes was an exceptional actor on the show and they treated her appallingly by letting her go and then recasting with Donna Reed.

Lorimar didn't appreciate the female cast at all and some of their decisions like recasting Miss Ellie were ultimately to the detriment of the show.

 

[KayLloyd]

Victoria deserved every dollar that Patrick got, if not more. But the producers didn’t value women. And they weren’t alone. Look at Three’s Company, which initially made over a half billion dollars in syndication. Suzanne Somers had the nerve to ask for a piece of that. And the producers, by many accounts, enjoyed belittling her and punishing her by writing her part down to almost nothing before firing her. And the press went along with it, depicting her as the villain. Somers was not innocent and made a lot of missteps while negotiating. But the misogyny was clear to me: how dare this woman ask to share in the profits of a show where she was a significant player?

Victoria deserved every dollar that Patrick got, if not more. But the producers didn’t value women. And they weren’t alone. Look at Three’s Company, which initially made over a half billion dollars in syndication. Suzanne Somers had the nerve to ask for a piece of that. And the producers, by many accounts, enjoyed belittling her and punishing her by writing her part down to almost nothing before firing her. And the press went along with it, depicting her as the villain. Somers was not innocent and made a lot of missteps while negotiating. But the misogyny was clear to me: how dare this woman ask to share in the profits of a show where she was a significant player?

Suzanne played risky and foolish ego games and deserved the consequences. Joyce DeWitt, who had more experience in the business than Suzanne, supposedly advised her that the best tactic was for the two of them to stick together in the negotiations, but no , Suzanne ignored her. She screwed over Joyce and sent her idiot hot head husband into the negotiations, and he screwed her over by getting her fired and her reputation ruined. I can't believe that she didn't divorce him over that. ABC wasn't going to be held hostage by Suzanne like CBS was by Larry Hagman, but if Alan hadn't been such a jackass, they most likely would have given her a very generous raise that although wasn't as much as she wanted, would still have been a hell of a lot of money and kept her employed. My sense is that her screwing Joyce over was what really pissed John Ritter off.

 

[Rove]

Larry Hagman for several reasons had a salary not comparable to other actors.

Larry certainly understood the power of circumstance. After the infamous shooting of JR Ewing he was in a position to demand an increase in salary and got it. When I now watch 'No More Mr Mister Nice Guy' it's laughable that Larry is not actually there in that hospital bed but a stand...well lie in, while Larry holds out for that money. I get why actors do this because they will never know if another once in a lifetime role will come around in their career.

Larry's high salary though should never have been approved, the hierarchy blinked. Dallas was an ensemble series. JR was the standout character but his very being relied on having those other characters around him; Jock, Miss Ellie, Sue Ellen, Bobby, Pam, Ray & Donna. It's easy to say it now but the main cast should have all been on equal pay. They were all deserving to share in the success of Dallas. But it's funny how a fictional series doesn't reflect real life when it should.

Some her are discussing the issue of misogyny and equal pay and whether the female actors were being treated unfairly and if Victoria was right to request equal pay parity with Patrick. In real life Victoria leaves the series which made her an international name. She uses that to create and eventually sell Principle Secret which makes her one wealthy woman.

In Dallas the writers or producers didn't think or didn't know how to write a story showcasing a successful business woman. In real life Victoria certainly showed how it was possible.

 

[Luke_Krebbs_Ewing]

Larry certainly understood the power of circumstance. After the infamous shooting of JR Ewing he was in a position to demand an increase in salary and got it. When I now watch 'No More Mr Mister Nice Guy' it's laughable that Larry is not actually there in that hospital bed but a stand...well lie in, while Larry holds out for that money. I get why actors do this because they will never know if another once in a lifetime role will come around in their career.

Larry's high salary though should never have been approved, the hierarchy blinked. Dallas was an ensemble series. JR was the standout character but his very being relied on having those other characters around him; Jock, Miss Ellie, Sue Ellen, Bobby, Pam, Ray & Donna. It's easy to say it now but the main cast should have all been on equal pay. They were all deserving to share in the success of Dallas. But it's funny how a fictional series doesn't reflect real life when it should.

Some her are discussing the issue of misogyny and equal pay and whether the female actors were being treated unfairly and if Victoria was right to request equal pay parity with Patrick. In real life Victoria leaves the series which made her an international name. She uses that to create and eventually sell Principle Secret which makes her one wealthy woman.

In Dallas the writers or producers didn't think or didn't know how to write a story showcasing a successful business woman. In real life Victoria certainly showed how it was possible.

Victoria Principal is one smart lady. She left Dallas and went on to bigger and better things. She started her own cosmetics business. I also remember her doing fitness videos.

She certainly proved herself as a successful business woman and dare I say it, as business savvy as her Dallas counterpart Pamela Barnes Ewing.

 

[Julia's Gun]

Lorimar didn't appreciate the female cast at all and some of their decisions like recasting Miss Ellie were ultimately to the detriment of the show.

I agree with regards to Miss Ellie and the treatment of Susan Howard, but in the interview below (around 22:10) Victoria says that Lenny (Katzman) begged her to stay and they went back to her and offered her a fortune to make her the highest paid woman on TV at the time. It sounds like it was she who made up her mind she wanted to go and despite the offer she couldn't be tempted back.

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

I agree with regards to Miss Ellie and the treatment of Susan Howard, but in the interview below (around 22:10) Victoria says that Lenny (Katzman) begged her to stay and they went back to her and offered her a fortune to make her the highest paid woman on TV at the time. It sounds like it was she who made up her mind she wanted to go and despite the offer she couldn't be tempted back.

Spin, people, spin.

She could have been tempted back, but Lorimar wouldn't pay her as much as she wanted; and she was only willing to return for one year, not two.

By the time they were conceding to her demands a year later, she'd already severed ties.

 

[Julia's Gun]

I wonder where they had all this money to pay Victoria? When Lorimar merged with Telepictures, they wanted to cut the budgets of the big soaps. Knots had to trim it's cast in 1987, with Laura and Lilimae getting the chop. With Bobby back on Dallas, and Larry and Barbara getting big salaries, how come Dallas seemed to still have the big budget? Weren't all the soaps viewing figures starting to tank around this period as well?

I'm surprised they were so desperate to have Pam return, after they had messed up so badly with how she was written out.

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

I wonder where they had all this money to pay Victoria? When Lorimar merged with Telepictures, they wanted to cut the budgets of the big soaps. Knots had to trim it's cast in 1987, with Laura and Lilimae getting the chop. With Bobby back on Dallas, and Larry and Barbara getting big salaries, how come Dallas seemed to still have the big budget? Weren't all the soaps viewing figures starting to tank around this period as well?

I'm surprised they were so desperate to have Pam return, after they had messed up so badly with how she was written out.

I'm not sure how big BBG's salary really was. Telepictures was slashing budgets, and they weren't willing to meet VP's demands -- and she was no longer in the mood to compromise (and I don't blame her). And DALLAS likely had the biggest budget because DALLAS was DALLAS.

Leonard Katzman had the reputation for being the kind of producer who took care of the actors, so he apparently managed the dollars in such a way that he could keep the core group together as long as he could, and also film in Texas for 6 weeks every year through 1988.

But these production companies -- often in tandem with the network -- can come up with the money when they want to. They suddenly decided they could give Victoria parity with Duffy once she'd been gone for a year and the series started to spiral. But she was no longer interested.

And Larry was making 350,000 dollars per episode during the last three years when the ratings had collapsed and DALLAS was in the basement.

So the quixotic accounting doesn't make any sense to us. It probably doesn't even make any sense to them...



"I'm leaving Southfork, Bobby, and everything that Telepictures and their deteriorating scripts stand for..."

 

[Luke_Krebbs_Ewing]

Spin, people, spin.

She could have been tempted back, but Lorimar wouldn't pay her as much as she wanted; and she was only willing to return for one year, not two.

By the time they were conceding to her demands a year later, she'd already severed ties.

You know it's ironic, Lorimar bent over backwards to accede to Larry Hagman's wishs and demands but when Victoria Principal did it they weren't so flexible to agreeing with her in order to get her to stay!

 

[Rove]

And DALLAS likely had the biggest budget because DALLAS was DALLAS.

Possibly because Dallas was still enjoying international viewership compared to Falcon Crest and Knots Landing.

 

[Rove]

They suddenly decided they could give Victoria parity with Duffy once she'd been gone for a year and the series started to spiral

It's why I believe the character of Pam was vital to the continued success of Dallas. Once she was gone that element of spark and conflict between the two warring families had evaporated. Pity the producers didn't see the importance of the character or actor.

 

[Laurie!]

What I don't understand is why they had to slash payroll by getting rid of Linda, Charlene, Steve and in large part, BBG as well and thought it was good business sense to cave to Patrick's demands.

They also aĺlowed Patrick and Larry to control the budget by getting their vacations paid for...Austria, Russia and France. That cost a tonne of money. That sort of selfishness is why I don't buy into the BS about "the three musketeers", all for one, one for all nonsense Patrick spews now.

 

[southfork88]

What I don't understand is why they had to slash payroll by getting rid of Linda, Charlene, Steve and in large part, BBG as well and thought it was good business sense to cave to Patrick's demands.

They also aĺlowed Patrick and Larry to control the budget by getting their vacations paid for...Austria, Russia and France. That cost a tonne of money. That sort of selfishness is why I don't buy into the BS about "the three musketeers", all for one, one for all nonsense Patrick spews now.

Unfortunately both Falcon Crest and Knots Landing were not broadcast in Italy until the natural end of their seasons. Only Dallas and Dynasty had this privilege.

And surely letting colleagues fire and then spending the budget on holidays in Austria, Russia and France is not ethically a reward for honesty

 

[Mustard]

And Larry was making 350,000 dollars per episode during the last three years when the ratings had collapsed and DALLAS was in the basement.

Larry was an executive producer by that time, so his wages on Dallas weren't just coming from playing J.R. Ewing anymore.

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

Larry was an executive producer by that time, so his wages on Dallas weren't just coming from playing J.R. Ewing anymore.

Yes, but his co-executive producer title wouldn't have pushed his salary up by as much as that -- not circa 1990. He was likely getting it from network supplements (which were ceased for the show by that point because the ratings were crashing, but may have been made available to Larry to keep him around) and retroactive raises (which are a thing) and profit percentage deals where he gets a ton of money upfront in anticipation of later syndication profits... Larry said he'd never want a back-end deal because he knew people who'd had back-end residual deals and were in and out of court for the rest of their lives, trying to collect on what was owed them.

But then Larry and Maj were screwed by Bernie Madoff, which necessitated Hagman taking nuDALLAS.

You can always get screwed by somebody.

 

[Laurie!]

And surely letting colleagues fire and then spending the budget on holidays in Austria, Russia and France is not ethically a reward for honesty

For a business decision, I can't blame Patrick and Larry for looking out for themselves financially. I just know in most cases, co-workers in an ensemble group, don't remain friends when one squeezes out the others, causes them to lose work (screen time) or fired because that one person wants the ensemble to be a duo with more money.

They certainly squeezed out Linda too and she's supposedly a best friend. I just think with friends like those, you don't need enemies. So I tend to disbelieve that they're all as close as they say. So who can believe anything they say about Victoria?

 

[Mustard]

Larry certainly understood the power of circumstance. After the infamous shooting of JR Ewing he was in a position to demand an increase in salary and got it. When I now watch 'No More Mr Mister Nice Guy' it's laughable that Larry is not actually there in that hospital bed but a stand...well lie in, while Larry holds out for that money. I get why actors do this because they will never know if another once in a lifetime role will come around in their career.

Larry's high salary though should never have been approved, the hierarchy blinked. Dallas was an ensemble series. JR was the standout character but his very being relied on having those other characters around him; Jock, Miss Ellie, Sue Ellen, Bobby, Pam, Ray & Donna. It's easy to say it now but the main cast should have all been on equal pay. They were all deserving to share in the success of Dallas. But it's funny how a fictional series doesn't reflect real life when it should.

Larry was also smart enough to realize that he should be out of the USA entirely when the episode aired over there, so he took a trip to Britain and moved about a bit across the country while he was over here. The result was that when the cliffhanger gripped the American public, the brass were chasing him all over the place instead of merely dictating what would happen next as would have been the case had he been in the US at the time. Larry was basically saying "this is what I want or I'm off". Larry believed that it was impossible at that time for Dallas to continue without him as J.R. Ewing in the series, and he was right.

The actors were all behind Larry at the time. It would mean increased pay and power for them too compared to before. Larry and Patrick also got to direct some episodes after this as well, meaning more money on top of their acting roles.

Some her are discussing the issue of misogyny and equal pay and whether the female actors were being treated unfairly and if Victoria was right to request equal pay parity with Patrick. In real life Victoria leaves the series which made her an international name. She uses that to create and eventually sell Principle Secret which makes her one wealthy woman.

In Dallas the writers or producers didn't think or didn't know how to write a story showcasing a successful business woman. In real life Victoria certainly showed how it was possible.

I do wonder where the whole "Dallas is a man's show" machismo thing around 1986-87 came from. Was it Barbara Carrera from the previous year annoying them? Cliff seemed to have had a personality transplant in Season 10 DVD.

 

[Mustard]

For a business decision, I can't blame Patrick and Larry for looking out for themselves financially. I just know in most cases, co-workers in an ensemble group, don't remain friends when one squeezes out the others, causes them to lose work (screen time) or fired because that one person wants the ensemble to be a duo with more money.

They certainly squeezed out Linda too and she's supposedly a best friend. I just think with friends like those, you don't need enemies. So I tend to disbelieve that they're all as close as they say. So who can believe anything they say about Victoria?

The Dallas cast do have the Ewing philosophy, i.e. whatever arguments and differences that we have among ourselves, we stick together as a family when it comes to the outside world.

 

[Laurie!]

The Dallas cast do have the Ewing philosophy, i.e. whatever arguments and differences that we have among ourselves, we stick together as a family when it comes to the outside world.

Could also be the JR Ewing blackmail mentality. Polaroids and such do exist for keeping their mouths shut.