Queens -- and Joan's jealousy of Linda

[Snarky Oracle!]

I was scrolling through Facebook and ran across a post by one of the DYNASTY pages, and the post quoted Gordon Thomson's observation that Joan Collins was jealous of Linda on the set because Linda was effortlessly well-liked by the cast & crew while Joan's reputations was, for reasons that should be readily obvious, more complicated.

To any even halfway observant person, this should be apparent. That's just Joan.

But you would never know it by the homosexualist male responses. An endless slew of terse, incredulous reactions of "Doubtful"/"No way!"/"I don't buy it!"/"But Joan MADE Dynasty!" on and on and on... How can a congregation of fey, hardcore DYNASTY fans have so little understanding of their heroine, Joan Collins? Her insecurities and her pretentions?

Do they really think Collins was Alexis? Do they truly believe Joan's 24/7 bragging in every interview she's ever given since the '80s ended is reflective of unabashed self-confidence?

Why are these boys so naive and easily swayed by Joan's affected bravura, a bravura which is as easy to see through as plastic wrap?

And don't even let me go off on a tangent about Joan's jealousy of Linda being a kind of affectation in itself: where Joan's "envy" of Linda wasn't actual envy but Joan's performative envy based on what Joan believes Alexis' envy would be of Krystle in the same situation... So even Joan's transparent insecurities aren't quite what they seem to be, (@Ked doesn't believe I know these things).

Yet these old queens seem to droolingly buy into it completely, never even questioning Joan's invulnerable fabulosity for two seconds. Even after 40 years.

Bitches be cray-cray. Bitches be cray.

 

[Ked]

(@Ked doesn't believe I know these things).

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

View attachment 58955View attachment 58956View attachment 58957View attachment 58958

Domestic violence. I always knew you were the type!

 

[Willie Oleson]

Gordon Thomson's observation

And that becomes our discussion. Long live the internet.

"Fans also seemed to favour Linda's character Krystle to Joan's Alexis".

Would it be possible that the story and characters were set up to have that effect?
Come on, it's a self-explanatory BS statement.
But even so, the most-liked character isn't necessarily the most entertaining character and it's possible that many people wouldn't be Dynasty fans if Alexis wasn't written into the story.
That's where the "Joan MADE Dynasty!!" sentiment comes from, since she's the only actress who's ever played her. She was the "best choice" for Alexis because an alternative Alexis doesn't exist.
To further blur and complicate that sentiment, Joan Collins actually was a terrific casting choice - probably (and most ironically) because she's very likeable in a self-UNaware kind of way.

Gordon Thomson *said* (he's just as informatively reliable as Joan, talk about perfect casting)...but for the sake of argument let's say it's true.
If you think about it for a moment (it's the internet here but that's no legitimate excuse not to try) then, of course, it has nothing to do with Linda Evans' character or reputation. And it wouldn't take much effort for Joan to be equally liked anyway.

But I can imagine that that sort of jealousy could have developed from feeling underrated from an artistic/professional point of view, as if Joan's contribution to the series would always be overshadowed by Linda Evans.
And since the gay fanboys think that Joan was Dynasty's Numero Uno then that claim doesn't make sense.

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

And that becomes our discussion. Long live the internet.

"Fans also seemed to favour Linda's character Krystle to Joan's Alexis".

Would it be possible that the story and characters were set up to have that effect?
Come on, it's a self-explanatory BS statement.
But even so, the most-liked character isn't necessarily the most entertaining character and it's possible that many people wouldn't be Dynasty fans if Alexis wasn't written into the story.
That's where the "Joan MADE Dynasty!!" sentiment comes from, since she's the only actress who's ever played her. She was the "best choice" for Alexis because an alternative Alexis doesn't exist.
To further blur and complicate that sentiment, Joan Collins actually was a terrific casting choice - probably (and most ironically) because she's very likeable in a self-UNaware kind of way.

Gordon Thomson *said* (he's just as informatively reliable as Joan, talk about perfect casting)...but for the sake of argument let's say it's true.
If you think about it for a moment (it's the internet here but that's no legitimate excuse not to try) then, of course, it has nothing to do with Linda Evans' character or reputation. And it wouldn't take much effort for Joan to be equally liked anyway.

But I can imagine that that sort of jealousy could have developed from feeling underrated from an artistic/professional point of view, as if Joan's contribution to the series would always be overshadowed by Linda Evans.
And since the gay fanboys think that Joan was Dynasty's Numero Uno then that claim doesn't make sense.

View attachment 58963

Okay, so, what are you saying?

 

[Zara]

Well;

the fight over Blake was a fight over his soul. In this contrast the behind-the-scene-drama makes even more sense.

 

[Zara]

"And don't even let me go off on a tangent about Joan's jealousy of Linda being a kind of affectation in itself: where Joan's "envy" of Linda wasn't actual envy but Joan's performative envy based on what Joan believes Alexis' envy would be of Krystle in the same situation..."

Actually, it works out quite good on the show. Notice how Alexis always roll her eyes at Krystle when K begins to rant how much better person she is. I always thought of this like true contempt. Because Joan's/Alexis' face expressed it beyond acting.

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

Joan's neuroses are interesting. Has anybody seen the footage of the 1983 fashion show with Nolan Miller and Joan and Linda in Los Angeles? With Linda in that gorgeous brown sequined gown and Joan in that silver outfit?

We think of Joan as more confident on DYNASTY and Linda the more insecure. But when the pair walk down the catwalk together, Linda is poised and graceful as hell, mastering her spin flawlessly. In contrast, Joan moves like a horse, constantly pulling up her dress at the shoulder -- not because it keeps slipping down, but because she's too self-conscious, almost like a nerd who deliberately acts the fool to obscure the fact he/she already feels like a fool.

If only Linda had maintained that self-assurance on the series itself.

Years ago, Collins did an interview with the American version of 60 MINUTES (not the Australian version a couple of years ago, where she called the contemptuous interviewer "gay"). They described her as the most important villainess "in television history" and, not gushingly, took her very, very seriously. And Joan couldn't handle it. She melted down and started to stammer.

Joan doesn't think she's legitimate on some level. Although that worked well for Alexis, the vengeful woman scorned.

 

[Willie Oleson]

Joan doesn't think she's legitimate on some level.

Or maybe she's just rational and feels uncomfortable to put "Dynasty" and "most important" in the same context. She never had to sell it, the interviewers always did the work for her.
Yes, Alexis was a soap rock star, a very influential pop culture icon and the template for many, many Alexis knockoffs. But it wasn't Citizen Kane and she knew it.

And look at that picture of decadent eightiesness: Nolan Miller gloss, a real-life Peter De Vilbis and little Tori Spelling taking snapshots.

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

Or maybe she's just rational and feels uncomfortable to put "Dynasty" and "most important" in the same context. She never had to sell it, the interviewers always did the work for her.
Yes, Alexis was a soap rock star, a very influential pop culture icon and the template for many, many Alexis knockoffs. But it wasn't Citizen Kane and she knew it.

And look at that picture of decadent eightiesness: Nolan Miller gloss, a real-life Peter De Vilbis and little Tori Spelling taking snapshots.

And anybody who marries Peter Holm -- or Andrew Stevens, for that matter -- has to have serious self-esteem issues.

On the other hand, Gore Vidal praised Joan for being one of the few actresses who didn't take herself too seriously. Although I'm not sure if what Vidal was seeing was quite what Joan was doing.

 

[Willie Oleson]

And anybody who marries Peter Holm -- or Andrew Stevens, for that matter -- has to have serious self-esteem issues.

Is a trophy husband worse than a trophy wife?

Andrew, I'd marry you

And also Stephen Collins

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

Is a trophy husband worse than a trophy wife?

Of course it's no worse. But an overt slimeball trophy spouse connotes some kind of psychiatric judgment issue. One would think.

Andrew, I'd marry you

I'm too old for you. But you're sweet.

And also Stephen Collins

And apparently, you're too old for him.

 

[Willie Oleson]

But an overt slimeball trophy spouse connotes some kind of psychiatric judgment issue. One would think.

Maybe he wasn't being an overt slimeball to her.
And he's Euroxotic Swedish, that makes it all very adventurous.

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

Yeah, he looks like a peach. Even before they were married, all of her friends disliked him.

She was ignoring it.

 

[Willie Oleson]

You always have so much proof. How can I possibly win this?

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

You always have so much proof. How can I possibly win this?

Whaddaya want?

Joan has said in numerous interviews that all her friends didn't like him.

 

[Willie Oleson]

Oh now you believed her?

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

Oh now you believed her?

Someone is in an oppositional-defiant mood.

Do you think it might be me?