So how would YOU have saved Dallas?

Kenny Coyote

Telly Talk Star
Victoria was clearly determined to leave the show when she did, so all the more reason to retain every one else, rather than bringing in utterly woeful entries such as the junior McKays, Granny Beaumont and her clan.

The series needed to remain an ensemble piece, rather than focusing just on JR & Bobby in the last few seasons.

Swami

Don't forget Cliff. He was a big part of the show in the last few seasons. The oil tanker collision storyline with Cliff having the power to cast the deciding vote in determining who was at fault was a good story.

Is't it possible that Larry Hagman, Patrick Duffy, Ken Kercheval, and George Kennedy could have been utilized better? I sure hope so! I think a producer that has those actors to work with, along with some talented new actors chosen with discernment, would have to be an idiot to not be able to make some consistently good seasons of Dallas...unless the writing sucks....and for the most part it did in the last few years.
 

Swami

Telly Talk Supreme
Don't forget Cliff. He was a big part of the show in the last few seasons. The oil tanker collision storyline with Cliff having the power to cast the deciding vote in determining who was at fault was a good story.

Is't it possible that Larry Hagman, Patrick Duffy, Ken Kercheval, and George Kennedy could have been utilized better? I sure hope so! I think a producer that has those actors to work with, along with some talented new actors chosen with discernment, would have to be an idiot to not be able to make some consistently good seasons of Dallas...unless the writing sucks....and for the most part it did in the last few years.

Again, the writing was probably part of the problem. Victoria said she felt the writing had started to deteriorate two years before she eventually left.

Season 10 was an excellent season, but everything went downhill fairly quickly after that, both in terms of the standards of writing and quality cast members leaving and being replaced by individuals who simply were not up to scratch.

Swami
 

Kenny Coyote

Telly Talk Star
Again, the writing was probably part of the problem. Victoria said she felt the writing had started to deteriorate two years before she eventually left.

Season 10 was an excellent season, but everything went downhill fairly quickly after that, both in terms of the standards of writing and quality cast members leaving and being replaced by individuals who simply were not up to scratch.

Swami

They made a lot of bad decisions all at around the same time. They knew Victoria Principal was leaving and still they let Priscilla Presley and Deborah Shelton go too. They looked like they were trying to get rid of all the best looking women on the show. Meanwhile, since they'd brought Bobby back from the dead, why not have a storyline where maybe Jock is coming back too? I don't think they were playing with a full deck.
 

Swami

Telly Talk Supreme
They made a lot of bad decisions all at around the same time. They knew Victoria Principal was leaving and still they let Priscilla Presley and Deborah Shelton go too. They looked like they were trying to get rid of all the best looking women on the show. Meanwhile, since they'd brought Bobby back from the dead, why not have a storyline where maybe Jock is coming back too? I don't think they were playing with a full deck.

Although the Parmalee storyline was good, I am surprised if they really considered recasting the role of Jock. They knew how much Jim Davis had made the role his own, and how much the cast thought of him, that never would have worked.

Swami
 

Kenny Coyote

Telly Talk Star
Although the Parmalee storyline was good, I am surprised if they really considered recasting the role of Jock. They knew how much Jim Davis had made the role his own, and how much the cast thought of him, that never would have worked.

Swami

On the special features of the season 10 DVD, they say they never intended to have Parmalee turn out to be Jock....That they were keeping Jock's memory ( and Jim Davis's memory) alive by showing the painting of him and by still mentioning Jock as often as they did. But we didn't know that when we were watching and considering how they had just brought Bobby back after we'd seen him "die", I think it was a bit much to also have a storyline where another major character who was considered dead might turn out not to be dead.

As for casting mistakes: maybe the worst of all was casting Sasha Mitchell as JR's son. Having JR find out he had an adult son could have been very good if they'd had a good actor playing the role of his son and of course having better scripts for his storyline.

That Sasha Mitchell got the job makes me wonder what the other actors who auditioned for the role were like. I've gotta think that for a high profile TV role like that, some pretty good young actors must have auditioned, ones who would have played the role better.
 
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Swami

Telly Talk Supreme
On the special features of the season 10 DVD, they say they never intended to have Parmalee turn out to be Jock....That they were keeping Jock's memory ( and Jim Davis's memory) alive by showing the painting of him and by still mentioning Jock as often as they did. But we didn't know that when we were watching and considering how they had just brought Bobby back after we'd seen him "die", I think it was a bit much to also have a storyline where another major character who was considered dead might turn out not to be dead.

As for casting mistakes: maybe the worst of all was casting Sasha Mitchell as JR's son. Having JR find out he had an adult son could have been very good if they'd had a good actor playing the role of his son and of course having better scripts for his storyline.

That Sasha Mitchell got the job makes me wonder what the other actors who auditioned for the role were like. I've gotta think that for a high profile TV role like that, some pretty good young actors must have auditioned, ones who would have played the role better.

He was truly awful, as was J Eddie Peck and Jeri Gaile. I think all told they were the three worst.

Swami
 

Kenny Coyote

Telly Talk Star
He was truly awful, as was J Eddie Peck and Jeri Gaile. I think all told they were the three worst.

Swami

Jeri Gaile - Was she Rose? I didn't like the actress who played Rose and didn't like the character either. I didn't see a guy like McKay going for that type of woman. Rose could have been from Haleyville too - Cally's trashy neighbor.

J Eddie Peck was alright the way he was originally shown, a guy with sort of long hair and a leather jacket who liked women and cocaine. It was something different for Dallas and I thought he did alright with that. When he came back, the short haired, business suit wearing, yet even crazier psycho persona wasn't convincing. That was bad.

Come to think of it, there was surprisingly little cocaine use shown in Dallas - a show about rich people in the 80s. We didn't ever see anyone besides Tommy McKay snort coke did we? Howard Keel said that there were Dallas parties for the actors and their spouses where they passed around a sugar bowl that was full of cocaine. There were some characters I could definitely picture liking cocaine:

In order of how likely:

Katherine Wentworth
Michelle Stevens
Kristin
Lucy
Gary
Jack
Maybe even JR and Sue Ellen on occasion
 
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Toni

Maximum Member
Jeri Gaile - Was she Rose? I didn't like the actress who played Rose and didn't like the character either. I didn't see a guy like McKay going for that type of woman. Rose could have been from Haleyville too - Cally's trashy neighbor.

J Eddie Peck was alright the way he was originally shown, a guy with sort of long hair and a leather jacket who liked women and cocaine. It was something different for Dallas and I thought he did alright with that. When he came back, the short haired, business suit wearing, yet even crazier psycho persona wasn't convincing. That was bad.

Come to think of it, there was surprisingly little cocaine use shown in Dallas - a show about rich people in the 80s. We didn't ever see anyone besides Tommy McKay snort coke did we? Howard Keel said that there were Dallas parties for the actors and their spouses where they passed around a sugar bowl that was full of cocaine. There were some characters I could definitely picture liking cocaine:

In order of how likely:

Katherine Wentworth
Michelle Stevens
Kristin
Lucy
Gary
Jack
Maybe even JR and Sue Ellen on occasion

There were a few characters who did use cocaine in the course of the series: Kristin (offscreen), Jeff Farraday (who also was a dealer), George Hicks, Naldo Marchetta and his "client" Veronica, and, of course, Tommy. Unfortunately, today showing someone using cocaine seems to be "fashionable" and "realistic" (and pathetically "funny"), though I think it´s just a proof of how small the writers´ brains are...who knows why... :re::censer:
 

Swami

Telly Talk Supreme
Jeri Gaile - Was she Rose? I didn't like the actress who played Rose and didn't like the character either. I didn't see a guy like McKay going for that type of woman. Rose could have been from Haleyville too - Cally's trashy neighbor.

J Eddie Peck was alright the way he was originally shown, a guy with sort of long hair and a leather jacket who liked women and cocaine. It was something different for Dallas and I thought he did alright with that. When he came back, the short haired, business suit wearing, yet even crazier psycho persona wasn't convincing. That was bad.

Come to think of it, there was surprisingly little cocaine use shown in Dallas - a show about rich people in the 80s. We didn't ever see anyone besides Tommy McKay snort coke did we? Howard Keel said that there were Dallas parties for the actors and their spouses where they passed around a sugar bowl that was full of cocaine. There were some characters I could definitely picture liking cocaine:

In order of how likely:

Katherine Wentworth
Michelle Stevens
Kristin
Lucy
Gary
Jack
Maybe even JR and Sue Ellen on occasion

Yes, Jeri Gaile was the dreadful Rose, and how implausible was the whole concept of her and Carter McKay in a relationship. Rose actually made Cally seem like landed gentry.

Swami
 

Kenny Coyote

Telly Talk Star
Prior to landing the role of James, did Sasha have a high profile in the United States? I had never heard of him prior to popping up on Dallas. I have to say he was perfectly cast as Cody on Step By Step.

I know he did some martial arts style movies, but I don't know if they came before his time on Dallas or after. Probably after. If you're interested , look up the movie series Kickboxer. The first was successful and starred Jean Claude Van Damme. The Kockboxer II, Kickboxer III, and so on were not anywhere near as successful. Sasha Mitchell is in at least one of the Kickboxer sequels.
 

Kenny Coyote

Telly Talk Star
There were a few characters who did use cocaine in the course of the series: Kristin (offscreen), Jeff Farraday (who also was a dealer), George Hicks, Naldo Marchetta and his "client" Veronica, and, of course, Tommy. Unfortunately, today showing someone using cocaine seems to be "fashionable" and "realistic" (and pathetically "funny"), though I think it´s just a proof of how small the writers´ brains are...who knows why... :re::censer:

Is it fashionable today to show people using cocaine? I didn't know that; I thought coke was much more of an 80s and 90s thing. I knew lots of people back then who did coke and they've all quit by now. Mostly what I hear about now is "the heroin epidemic." In the USA the that's what the government is actually calling it - an epidemic. It's actually gotten to where doctors are afraid to prescribe painkillers. There is a heroin problem in the USA, but the paranoia has gotten way out of hand. Some people genuinely need painkillers for legit medical reasons and can't get them. Is it like that in Europe too?
 

Toni

Maximum Member
Is it fashionable today to show people using cocaine? I didn't know that; I thought coke was much more of an 80s and 90s thing. I knew lots of people back then who did coke and they've all quit by now. Mostly what I hear about now is "the heroin epidemic." In the USA the that's what the government is actually calling it - an epidemic. It's actually gotten to where doctors are afraid to prescribe painkillers. There is a heroin problem in the USA, but the paranoia has gotten way out of hand. Some people genuinely need painkillers for legit medical reasons and can't get them. Is it like that in Europe too?

Kenny, first notice I wrote "fashionable", not fashionable. It´s very very sad but cocaine is the true epidemic in Europe now and since the early 90s, so it´s not getting better, it´s getting worse, because other types of drugs have been added to the "fashion". I´m not an expert but, as they say, "reality bites your a*s" sometimes.

In Spain, you just have to go out at night and find yourself in the middle of a dealing or seeing someone sniffing in the toilet. Just like that. It´s one of the reasons I do hate how the American shows have idealized the use and making and dealing with drugs. "Weeds", "Breaking Bad" and, without going any further, TNT´s "Dallas" shows things I don´t need to see because I do know are there and believe me, there are no "good and bad" drugs.

It´s a way of life: if one chooses it, then you are sentenced for life. Of course I´m sure there are people here who will be cynical and think: "How naïve, I do control it", but it´s all bullsh*t: using drugs alienates people from other people and helps make illegal, inhuman business to people who are just parasites. And seeing what politicians do about it (nothing), this will probably never change. Sorry if this is depressing to you (it actually is to me). So no, coke has not disappeared at all. And, in a sense, the Tommy storyline was meaningful at the time, up until he became a psycho and a Melrose Place-looking character, of course. That was as crap as it could be.
 
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Kenny Coyote

Telly Talk Star
Kenny, first notice I wrote "fashionable", not fashionable. It´s very very sad but cocaine is the true epidemic in Europe now and since the early 90s, so it´s not getting better, it´s getting worse, because other types of drugs have been added to the "fashion". I´m not an expert but, as they say, "reality bites your a*s" sometimes.

In Spain, you just have to go out at night and find yourself in the middle of a dealing or seeing someone sniffing in the toilet. Just like that. It´s one of the reasons I do hate how the American shows have idealized the use and making and dealing with drugs. "Weeds", "Breaking Bad" and, without going any further, TNT´s "Dallas" shows things I don´t need to see because I do know are there and believe me, there are no "good and bad" drugs.

It´s a way of life: if one chooses it, then you are sentenced for life. Of course I´m sure there are people here who will be cynical and think: "How naïve, I do control it", but it´s all bullsh*t: using drugs alienates people from other people and helps make illegal, inhuman business to people who are just parasites. And seeing what politicians do about it (nothing), this will probably never change. Sorry if this is depressing to you (it actually is to me). So no, coke has not disappeared at all. And, in a sense, the Tommy storyline was meaningful at the time, up until he became a psycho and a Melrose Place-looking character, of course. That was as crap as it could be.

Great post, Toni! The best advice I've ever heard about drugs is: "If you don't want to become a drug addict, don't ever pick up that drug for the first time, because the problem is, you'll like it." I don't like having to stop doing anything I like, and I don't like to do anything halfway. So I'd rather not start, and then I don't have to stop.

I think Breaking Bad is a show that, while it was a good show, has had a very negative influence in that so many people seem to want to copy what they did, to get that same success. None of those shows are going to be as good. The originator is always the best.

Here in America, our government has been trying to get rid of the drug problem, but I think they've gone about it in a highly destructive way. They go after drug use as a criminal problem when what we really have is a societal problem. Our government would rather punish people for drug possession than help them. Isn't it interesting how the government doesn't have the money to make it so there are places in drug rehab centers for people who need it, but they always have the money to put someone and keep someone in prison? It's a very punitive mentality that has accomplished nothing positive.
 

Luke_Krebbs_Ewing

Telly Talk Champion
They made a lot of bad decisions all at around the same time. They knew Victoria Principal was leaving and still they let Priscilla Presley and Deborah Shelton go too. They looked like they were trying to get rid of all the best looking women on the show. Meanwhile, since they'd brought Bobby back from the dead, why not have a storyline where maybe Jock is coming back too? I don't think they were playing with a full deck.

Jock coming back? :yikey:

But I thought you were against Wes Parmalee/Ben Stivers being Jock!?! :confused:
 

southfork88

Telly Talk TV Fanatic
Prior to landing the role of James, did Sasha have a high profile in the United States? I had never heard of him prior to popping up on Dallas. I have to say he was perfectly cast as Cody on Step By Step.

Couldn't have J.R. even a slightly stupid son? Anything wrong ... ;)
 

CeeCee72

Telly Talk Star
I'm not sure the show was salvageable after season eleven. The things that made it fail were all things that had been building for years. The beginning of the end was the dream season. As soon as you toss an entire season in the trash and ask the audience to forget it ever happened, there's really no turning back.

Season ten was decent - but only because of Parmelee and Calhoun. The Donna/Ray split felt rushed and forced. So did the JR/SE reconciliation. The Bobby/Pam/Jenna triangle bordered on ridiculous (Pam asking Jenna to give her the baby to raise? REALLY)? SE went from pitiful drunk to sober and strong in ONE episode. All of those storylines had been done already in season 9, and done better. (Also, the ridiculous idea that Pam dreamed sooo much about JR having sex or Sue Ellen booze binging or a guy who Ray hired as a ranch hand who looked JUST LIKE Wes Parmelee??? Just crazy!)

Then we get season eleven. Pam is gone in the weirdest way I can imagine. The writer's took a bulldozer to JR and SE AGAIN. We started losing so many well loved characters for ridiculous reasons and by the time season 12 rolled around it was hard to care anymore.

Yes. I know I am rambling. I guess my point is that I think Dallas started dying the minute Bobby showed up in that shower and that we just had a very long, painful death that lasted for years.
 
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