What if Ben Stivers . . .

Seaviewer

Telly Talk Warrior
Inspired by recent events on The Bold & The Beautiful.

What if Season 9 ended with Ben Stivers standing over a sleeping (or comatose) Bobby in a hospital bed with machines beeping around him, Bobby wakes up and Ben says "Good Morning".
Then in Season 10 it is revealed that Ben (or is it Jock?) had somehow spirited Bobby out of Dallas and has been secretly nursing him back to health for the past year?
 

Luke_Krebbs_Ewing

Telly Talk Champion
Inspired by recent events on The Bold & The Beautiful.

What if Season 9 ended with Ben Stivers standing over a sleeping (or comatose) Bobby in a hospital bed with machines beeping around him, Bobby wakes up and Ben says "Good Morning".
Then in Season 10 it is revealed that Ben (or is it Jock?) had somehow spirited Bobby out of Dallas and has been secretly nursing him back to health for the past year?

Unfortunately Leonard Katzman wanted the previous season erased when he came back for season ten.

We might have gotten something like that if Philip Capice had stayed.

The original season nine cliffhanger was Miss Ellie discovering items belonging to Jock in Ben's bunkhouse with Ben revealing he's really Jock. A similar cliffhanger was done for Wes in season ten.

Having Bobby in a coma would've been a better explanation than Pam's dream. It wouldn't have wiped the storylines away because obviously they still happened with Bobby being in a hospital following his so called accident.

A pity they couldn't come up with a more creative explanation for Bobby being still alive. :)
 

Snarky Oracle!

Telly Talk Supreme
Unfortunately Leonard Katzman wanted the previous season erased when he came back for season ten.

We might have gotten something like that if Philip Capice had stayed.

Chicken or the egg --- does it matter which came first when you're just going to eat both of 'em?

If Capice had stayed, we'd have no lousy dream resolution, but we'd have a Season 10 which was as off-base as Season 9.

With Katzman, we got a great Season 10 but also that dream.

Ambivalence, thy name is Stivers -- or is it Parmalee? ... Just more evidence that Ben/Wes is the metaphoric character in all of DALLAS.

Having Bobby in a coma would've been a better explanation than Pam's dream. It wouldn't have wiped the storylines away because obviously they still happened with Bobby being in a hospital following his so called accident.

Yes, the only way to have The Dream make even a lick of sense is to have it be Bobby's comatose dream, but no --- they had to hand blame off to the nearest ex-wife.
 

Seaviewer

Telly Talk Warrior
Yes, the only way to have The Dream make even a lick of sense is to have it be Bobby's comatose dream, but no --- they had to hand blame off to the nearest ex-wife.
No, I'm saying the previous year's events were real, they just happened while he was in a coma
Having Bobby in a coma would've been a better explanation than Pam's dream. It wouldn't have wiped the storylines away because obviously they still happened with Bobby being in a hospital following his so called accident.
Yes. Also, tying his story in with Ben's would remove the conflict of having two separate back-from-the-dead scenarios at the same time.
 

Taylor Bennett Jr.

Telly Talk Winner
they should have had it so that Ben was *literally* nursing Bobby back to health. The whole thing could have been Miss Ellie’s dream - Bobby’s death, her new more glamorous appearance, the reappearance of Jock as a mysterious lactating stranger.

It makes perfect sense given all she’d dealt with over the previous few years - the loss of a spouse, the trauma of a mastectomy, the foibles of her screwed-up sons…

With the Southfork matriarch too proud to seek out a Dr. Ellby type to help work through these issues, the task fell to her poor subconscious, and for that we were rewarded with Sue Ellen screaming in the drunk tank, the glamorous Angelica Nero, and the swashbuckling Matt Cantrell and his emeralds.
 
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Snarky Oracle!

Telly Talk Supreme
No, I'm saying the previous year's events were real, they just happened while he was in a coma

That's my preference as well -- I would never have used the dream scenario in any context either. To my mind, only something akin to a Federal Witness Protection explanation could work (ie, Bobby in a coma, then hidden away while he recuperates; perhaps Angela Nero was actually a high-end assassin hired to elaborately set up and knock off Ewings -- which could rationalize her convoluted business plot) because as much as some fans moan about that possibility too, it's the only one that could actually happen in real life.

And the explanation could be provided in a single episode (as opposed to a single scene).
 

Jock's Ghost

Telly Talk Well-Known Member
Whenever I can't sleep and need some mental gymnastics, I always go through the ways of how I would have kept DALLAS on track once Duffy said I'm out.
A fun exercise we've all heard the it before mostly....
I would have put Bobby in a coma. No Katherine did not try and kill him. It was done by some thugs hired by Wendell as we would find out later.
Even though Duffy is out, JR, Pam and Miss Ellie come to visit Bobby a few times this season, moreso with JR, much like he does when he's talking to their Daddy.
The brilliant part is that even if Duffy wanted to remain, out, Bobby could have remained in the coma indefinitely...... but since Duffy did he return, that could have easily been fixed.... just like the original cliffhanger.." it's far more suspenseful. His nurse comes in as we have seen several times before, to check his vitals, talking to him. This time, he struggles to say, GOOD MORNING"- BAM! freeze frame!
S10- opens with the family gathered 'round, Bobby struggles to talk, he can, but it's slow. A few episodes in, Bobby says he's not marring pam unless he can walk down the aisle on his own..... I dont recall the other plotlines but they play out mostly the same, Sue Ellen recovers from her brief blindness.
Ben Stivers announces who he is, and that plays out the same except he really IS Jock. In dealing with all of this, Clayton drops dead of a heart attack. YAY! JOCK now alive is back at Southfork helping Miss Ellie deal with Clayton's death, guilt over being with another man, etc....
JR is revitalized by his Daddy's return and his brother's healing. Yet is still slightly, ever so slightly that Daddy is not Jock and makes plans to protect the empire.
At this point in time, Jenna had committed suicide years earlier when she was in prison for killing Naldo. After her death, she's proven innocent. Bobby and the Ewings are tasked with raising Charlie. There's a brief mention of Jenna's long lost, older sister.....(I'm making shit up so I can make stuff up too)
By seasons end, Bobby and Pam are married, Charlie is now adopted by both- a DNA test prove Bobby IS her father.
S10 finale- Victora wants out..... FINE.
S10 finale is the same with a fiery car crash, MM is in the bandages....Change the actor with Margret Michaels as the storylines are not ruined or affected. This storyline plays out with Pam having doubts about her self-image and how bobby wont love her anymore with Bobby reminding her, he just helped him heal from a year long coma...they both ponder why tragic events keep interfering with their lives? Charlie grows closer to her, "adopted" mother and Miss Ellie.
Wendell is discoverd to be far more sinister than just a businessman. Cliff, JR join forces to bring him down......

If done correctly, the series could have lasted another 5-6 seasons easy. As terrible as it was, it lasted 4 more so maybe 7 seasons?

The final season has Pam, now mostly healed from the fire and surgeries, announcing she is able to carry a baby! Final episode shows Pam giving birth to twins!

Anyone tell me why this could not have been easily done? Duffy's exit and later entrance planned for possibly and nothing is ruined, no creditability lost, nothing affecting KNots Landing, no de-fanging of JR, no stupid Countess crap. No buggery from Michelle and April. Anyone have a better set up?

The sad thing is, I probably thought harder about this then that idiot Katzman and his ruination of a fantastic show.
 

Snarky Oracle!

Telly Talk Supreme
I've long-wanted the regally reptilian triumvirate of Jeremy Wendell, Lady Jessica, and cigarillo-chomping Leslie Stewart to bond together and descend on Dallas to try and destroy JR and Ewing Oil.

Like in BATMAN.

The idea was always facetious, but "facetious" can not be spelled without the word "fact" contained within -- and this, in any case, would be a lot better than what the show gave us in its closing seasons.

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Luke_Krebbs_Ewing

Telly Talk Champion
If only the Producers hadn't chickened out on revealing Wes as really being Jock the last four seasons might've been a lot better storyline wise.

As much as I loved Howard Keel as Clayton Farlow the character of Jock was badly needed on the show. Steve Forrest could've been a great Jock Ewing. A shame it wasn't to be.

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Snarky Oracle!

Telly Talk Supreme
If only the Producers hadn't chickened out on revealing Wes as really being Jock the last four seasons might've been a lot better storyline wise.

But we don't know that that's what happened. Peter Dunne may have intended Ben to be Jock, while Katzman/Paulsen supposedly never intended Wes to be Jock.

Again, the ambivalence made the plot work. Although the idea of Stivers/Parmalee turning out to actually be Jock in a concretely verfiable way sounds intriguing, I think it remains intriguing specifically because they didn't do it.

Likewise, Jeanne O'Brian worked better as a story arc when we only thought she might be Pam.

Some mysteries are more effective when they remain unsolved. A certain degree of fanwanking is good for the spleen, as long as it's not too much... If you've ever read my posts on fixing DYNASTY, you'd know how damaging it can all get.

C1ijsu-XcAEWarN.jpg
 

Seaviewer

Telly Talk Warrior
My original idea doesn't necessarily mean a definitive resolution to Ben's identity. His taking care of Bobby could be part of his delusion or con game, whichever you prefer.
 

Luke_Krebbs_Ewing

Telly Talk Champion
But again, we don't know that.... Someone needs to interview Peter Dunne if he's still alive.
I'm just off the phone with Peter Dunne Ben Stivers is Jock Ewing. ;)

But we don't know that that's what happened. Peter Dunne may have intended Ben to be Jock, while Katzman/Paulsen supposedly never intended Wes to be Jock.

Again, the ambivalence made the plot work. Although the idea of Stivers/Parmalee turning out to actually be Jock in a concretely verfiable way sounds intriguing, I think it remains intriguing specifically because they didn't do it.

Likewise, Jeanne O'Brian worked better as a story arc when we only thought she might be Pam.

Some mysteries are more effective when they remain unsolved. A certain degree of fanwanking is good for the spleen, as long as it's not too much... If you've ever read my posts on fixing DYNASTY, you'd know how damaging it can all get.

C1ijsu-XcAEWarN.jpg

But we don't know if Dynasty needed fixed!

I don't think even superglue could make the scripts better!

Or keep Steven's trousers up!

Someone really needs to ask the Shapiro's! :p
 

Billy Wall

Telly Talk Dream Maker
But we don't know that that's what happened. Peter Dunne may have intended Ben to be Jock, while Katzman/Paulsen supposedly never intended Wes to be Jock.

Again, the ambivalence made the plot work. Although the idea of Stivers/Parmalee turning out to actually be Jock in a concretely verfiable way sounds intriguing, I think it remains intriguing specifically because they didn't do it.

Likewise, Jeanne O'Brian worked better as a story arc when we only thought she might be Pam.

Some mysteries are more effective when they remain unsolved. A certain degree of fanwanking is good for the spleen, as long as it's not too much... If you've ever read my posts on fixing DYNASTY, you'd know how damaging it can all get.

C1ijsu-XcAEWarN.jpg

Whenever someone says “we don’t know if the producers really intended for Wes Parmelee to be Jock”, those x-rays are hard to overlook.
 
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Jock Ewing Fan

Telly Talk Star
I always wondered...

If bringing back Jock Ewing was the goal, it would seem to me that Jock wouldn't have been so secretive.

He would have openly declared "I am Jock Ewing ,my wife, sons, Ewing Oil and Southfork are mine, and I will
battle anyone who tries to take it from me"
My issue is with the writing.
Jock never would have been ok with Clayton at Southfork.


I always thought that not bringing back Jock was a big mistake
 
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