Another actor for Wes Parmalee

[Swami]

No, I don't think that would have worked.

Swami

 

[Laurie Marr]

Brian Keith?

 

[Luke_Krebbs_Ewing]

I wouldn't have used another actor for Wes Parmalee, Steve Forrest was perfect. He was a similar height & build & even had a similar bottom to Jim too. If it had've been up to me as Executive Producer of Dallas, I would have kept Steve Forrest on as Jock Ewing.

Yes he looked nothing like Jim Davis but that was explained away by the plastic surgery.

I would've had Wes bring irrefutable proof that he was actually Jock by him showing Miss Ellie a mole which he had on his chest to which Miss Ellie would recoil in shock. Something so simple as that which would prove exactly who he was.

 

[Kenny Coyote]

He was a similar height & build

Their builds were nothing alike.

I would've had Wes bring irrefutable proof that he was actually Jock by him showing Miss Ellie a mole which he had on his chest to which Miss Ellie would recoil in shock. Something so simple as that which would prove exactly who he was.

Suppose they do that and according to your story, because Wes brings irrefutable proof that he is Jock. Everyone who doubted him would then feel terribl and apologize profusely and say how wonderful it is to find out their beloved father is alive and well.

Then the show is stuck with an actor who the audience doesn't associate with Jock, just like they didn't think of Donna Reed as Miss Ellie. The fake Miss Ellie failed! Nobody liked that because they had already associated a specific actress with Miss Ellie. They already associated Jim Davis with Jock, so again, it won't work.

I've read that daytime soap operas do that sort of thing all the time because their audience tolerates it. Daytime soap opera compared to a primetime drama is like minor league baseball compared to Major League Baseball. At the top level of anything, the audience's standards are set a lot higher.

 

[Toni]

The only actor I can see as NuJock aka Parmalee is, funnily, Steve Forrest´s brother, Dana Andrews, as I said before in another thread. That way we could have a more interesting plot with Andrews playing a, let´s say, agonizing Jock (à la Garrison), who returns when he knows that his own brother, Jason, played by Forrest, is pretending to be him and "get all that was his". Twisted but also delicious. La Cidre would have loved it if she had known who Jock was, of course...

"Dammit boys, I´ll beat the hell out of you two!"​

 

[Chris2]

I couldn’t get past the age difference, the vocal difference, and the difference in mannerisms to truly believe Steve Forrest as Jock. James Arness would have been better. But they had the best outcome - they didn’t have anyone as a Jock recast.

 

[Luke_Krebbs_Ewing]

Their builds were nothing alike.

Suppose they do that and according to your story, because Wes brings irrefutable proof that he is Jock. Everyone who doubted him would then feel terrible and apologize profusely and say how wonderful it is to find out their beloved father is alive and well.

Then the show is stuck with an actor who the audience doesn't associate with Jock, just like they didn't think of Donna Reed as Miss Ellie. The fake Miss Ellie failed! Nobody liked that because they had already associated a specific actress with Miss Ellie. They already associated Jim Davis with Jock, so again, it won't work.

I've read that daytime soap operas do that sort of thing all the time because their audience tolerates it. Daytime soap opera compared to a primetime drama is like minor league baseball compared to Major League Baseball. At the top level of anything, the audience's standards are set a lot higher.

You don't know that for certain that the audience would'nt have ended up liking Steve Forrest's portrayal as Jock. They could've grown to love him. Yeah I'm prepared for a certain amount of a fan backlash but it's never a good idea to listen to a show's fans! I would've made sure that Jim Davis's portrayal as Jock wasn't forgotten in the wake of the re-cast.

As Executive Producer of Dallas the final decision would've been mine! Just as the final decision to bring back Patrick Duffy was Leonard Katzman's! And we all know what that did to the show.

 

[Kenny Coyote]

You don't know that for certain that the audience would'nt have ended up liking Steve Forrest's portrayal as Jock. They could've grown to love him. Yeah I'm prepared for a certain amount of a fan backlash but it's never a good idea to listen to a show's fans! I would've made sure that Jim Davis's portrayal as Jock wasn't forgotten in the wake of the re-cast.

As Executive Producer of Dallas the final decision would've been mine! Just as the final decision to bring back Patrick Duffy was Leonard Katzman's! And we all know what that did to the show.

I don't know for certain that they wouldn't have ended up liking Steve Forrest's portrayal as Jock but I know for certain that the response they had gotten to that point was overwhelmingly negative. They got a huge amount of letters from fans who hated the idea of Steve Forest playing the role Jim Davis had played. It's possible they could have done something else with Steve Forrest that would have worked better, but based on all indications at the time, what they were doing with him wasn't working.

A business has to listen to the people who consume their product to get an idea of what's working and what isn't working. I agree that you don't let the fans tell you how to run your show, but a company that continues running shows that are getting an overwhelmingly negative response is a company that isn't listening to its fans enough.

We saw what happened when Dallas took a character and despite the negative reaction, they remained insistent on featuring that character no matter what. They were determined to ram that character down the throats of the audience and make them like the character! That doesn't work. James is an example of that in Dallas. Elena is an example of that in TNT Dallas.

With Steve Forrest, I think there was a place for him on Dallas, but not as Jock. When they'd previously tried to recast a well established character it failed. The other time they had tried to bring back a character they told the audience was dead, it became the butt of a joke.

 

[Luke_Krebbs_Ewing]

I don't know for certain that they wouldn't have ended up liking Steve Forrest's portrayal as Jock but I know for certain that the response they had gotten to that point was overwhelmingly negative. They got a huge amount of letters from fans who hated the idea of Steve Forest playing the role Jim Davis had played. It's possible they could have done something else with Steve Forrest that would have worked better, but based on all indications at the time, what they were doing with him wasn't working.

A business has to listen to the people who consume their product to get an idea of what's working and what isn't working. I agree that you don't let the fans tell you how to run your show, but a company that continues running shows that are getting an overwhelmingly negative response is a company that isn't listening to its fans enough.

We saw what happened when Dallas took a character and despite the negative reaction, they remained insistent on featuring that character no matter what. They were determined to ram that character down the throats of the audience and make them like the character! That doesn't work. James is an example of that in Dallas. Elena is an example of that in TNT Dallas.

With Steve Forrest, I think there was a place for him on Dallas, but not as Jock. When they'd previously tried to recast a well established character it failed. The other time they had tried to bring back a character they told the audience was dead, it became the butt of a joke.

My decision to keep Steve Forrest as Jock Ewing stands. I am Executive Producer of Dallas after all & my decision is final.

If you'll excuse me Kenny, I'm phoning Steve Forrest!

 

[Taylor Bennett Jr.]

My decision to keep Steve Forrest as Jock Ewing stands. I am Executive Producer of Dallas after all & my decision is final.

If you'll excuse me Kenny, I'm phoning Steve Forrest!

that is acceptable only under one condition: Steve must agree to complete a course of elocution lessons focused on the proper pronunciation of ‘biness’

 

[Luke_Krebbs_Ewing]

that is acceptable only under one condition: Steve must agree to complete a course of elocution lessons focused on the proper pronunciation of ‘biness’

That will be really up to the Director's. However I shall mention it to him on the phone.

Steve may not want to emulate the role's originator too much but put his own stamp on the role. I don't like to put my foot down about this too much!

Now if you'll excuse me I have to make a phone call.

 

[Taylor Bennett Jr.]

That will be really up to the Director's. However I shall mention it to him on the phone.

Steve may not want to emulate the role's originator too much but put his own stamp on the role. I don't like to put my foot down about this too much!

Now if you'll excuse me I have to make a phone call.

I suppose that’s fair. I have more important biness to attend to anyway, namely the search for a third actor to portray the return of the mysterious Cousin Jimmy Monahan.

 

[Luke_Krebbs_Ewing]

I suppose that’s fair. I have more important biness to attend to anyway, namely the search for a third actor to portray the return of the mysterious Cousin Jimmy Monahan.

Cousin Jimmy! I've already decided on another actor for him, after much searching Casper Van Dien is to take the role.

 

[Kenny Coyote]

that is acceptable only under one condition: Steve must agree to complete a course of elocution lessons focused on the proper pronunciation of ‘biness’

Damn it, Guzzler, it's "bidness"! I like your idea though. Steve Forrest's delivery was too smooth and gentle sounding. Jock spoke in a gruff, gravelly, very abrupt way that was direct and to the point. Jock spoke in a way that would give an SJW a stroke. "Safe space? What the hell are you talkin' about boy? I've got a safe space for you out behind the barn"!

 

[Luke_Krebbs_Ewing]

Damn it, Guzzler, it's "bidness"! I like your idea though. Steve Forrest's delivery was too smooth and gentle sounding. Jock spoke in a gruff, gravelly, very abrupt way that was direct and to the point. Jock spoke in a way that would give an SJW a stroke. "Safe space? What the hell are you talkin' about boy? I've got a safe space for you out behind the barn"!

Jock Ewing, either Jim Davis or Steve Forrest will never get me behind the barn to do any business, bidness or biness!!

You're out of order Kenny & as Executive Producer of Dallas I expect an apology immediately otherwise I shall bring back Donna Reed as Miss Ellie!!

 

[Chris2]

And Phil Capice!

 

[Luke_Krebbs_Ewing]

Oh, I agree! We all found the storyline very silly. Mostly because neither his face, nor his build nor his mannerisms matched those of Jock and because it would mean the Ewing boys had all bungled the search for Jock, which would have been entirely out of character. They were very thorough people.

I'm also very against the principle of a different actor playing a well established character. it's insulting to the audience and looks cheap.

That being said, if they were determined to try it, Jock's face an body should have been scarred from the massive burning and he shouldn't have been anywhere near able-bodied enough to be the ranch foreman! He was retiring from full time work before he even went to South America, but all those years later, he is once again ready for full-time, more physical work? Considering the crash he sustained, he should have either been crippled (to some degree) or at the very least should have walked with a limp.

What you are not aware of is that after coming back to the States & before getting the job on the Running Zee Wes ran into a man called Steve Austin. With Steve's help & that of Oscar Goldman & the OSI, they completely re-built Wes.

We can rebuild him, we have the technology to make the worlds first bionic Ewing. Better than he was before, better, stronger, faster.

 

[Herofan]

So, if Wes had turned out to be Jock, what were they going to do with Clayton? That would certainly could have created an interesting storyline.

 

[Seaviewer]

It seemed like they were going somewhere with that. Clayton wasn't satisfied with the explanation relayed by Miss Ellie and talked about going to look for Wes. But then it was all quietly forgotten.

 

[Kenny Coyote]

It seemed like they were going somewhere with that. Clayton wasn't satisfied with the explanation relayed by Miss Ellie and talked about going to look for Wes. But then it was all quietly forgotten.

If he'd been Jock and Miss Ellie lied about him not being Jock, don't you think as Clayton was leaving to go look for him, she'd have then told the truth so as to avoid Clayton possibly killing Jock and ending up in prison? I'm not sure what the motivation to her would have been to lie about something that serious at all, but when she fully realized Clayton was really intent on killing him, don't you think at that point she'd decide she better tell the truth?