Biggest Drop in Quality

[Taylor Bennett Jr.]

Not to mention a family show.. The Cosby show of Friday nights! Or was it that Cosby was the Dallas of Thursday nights..I dunno. Now I'm so confused.

“Cosby turned out to be worse than JR when it came to women” wasn’t on many people’s bingo cards in the day…

 

[CeeCee72]

I agree with a lot of the others that feel that season 9 started out promisingly enough. They were just too quick to put Pam right back into Mark's arms, and out of the Ewing Oil conflict. I don't think the quality of season 9 was all that different from 8..it might even be a little more interesting, but neither season is a favorite of mine. I just felt bringing Mark back that fast just seemed kinda tacky, when Pam supposedly just lost the love of her life.

Was it as offensively handled as Bobby's stubborn coolness towards Pam in season 11? Heck no, but she didn't need to have a man that fast.

For me, season 9 actually seems kind of like a season for a series that's coming to a close, at least in some respects. I know that was nowhere in the game plan at that point, but the way a lot of the main characters started being kinder to one another..I dunno. I could have seen this being the last season, but then had it been, that might make one just wish they had ended it with "Swan Song". So, if Swan Song wasn't going to be the ending, I'm glad season 9 didn't end up being the closing season. That said, the way the show proceeded forward, we had to do some major suspension of disbelief.

When I watched Dallas with my child (who was watching for the first time) they were adamant that if Dallas had ended after season nine it would have been the perfect ending. JR finally got everything he wanted, Sue Ellen was finally sober, Pam had moved on with her life, and the family was all getting along. Would have been a happy ending.

 

[Bobby Southworth]

When I watched Dallas with my child (who was watching for the first time) they were adamant that if Dallas had ended after season nine it would have been the perfect ending. JR finally got everything he wanted, Sue Ellen was finally sober, Pam had moved on with her life, and the family was all getting along. Would have been a happy ending.

I can totally see that, and let's face it, the way some of these things took place, like Sue Ellen and the sobriety, were so much better executed than when they needed to 'just make them happen again' the following season. Only, I truly think Sue Ellen deserved better than J.R., and to have her morph into someone he could respect in the dream season.. I like that, but would have rather she try it on her own, or with someone new, not fall, once again, back into the vicious cycle. Granted, was that realistic? Probably

While I do think the 9th year could have been a good last season for the show, I would have much rather have the show end with Bobby and Pam reuniting(in Swan Song), than her and Mark Marrying. However, as it stands, the show didn't ultimately end with either being the case, Soo.. What a mess.

 

[Bobby Southworth]

When Paulsen left. Both times.

I could do a little research, but refresh my memory..when did he leave the first time? With Katzman in '85?

 

[CeeCee72]

I can totally see that, and let's face it, the way some of these things took place, like Sue Ellen and the sobriety, were so much better executed than when they needed to 'just make them happen again' the following season. Only, I truly think Sue Ellen deserved better than J.R., and to have her morph into someone he could respect in the dream season.. I like that, but would have rather she try it on her own, or with someone new, not fall, once again, back into the vicious cycle. Granted, was that realistic? Probably

While I do think the 9th year could have been a good last season for the show, I would have much rather have the show end with Bobby and Pam reuniting(in Swan Song), than her and Mark Marrying. However, as it stands, the show didn't ultimately end with either being the case, Soo.. What a mess.

To be fair, we skipped the dream season and then went back and watched it at the very end. Did a thread about it.

Rewatching Dallas with a newbie

I mentioned in an earlier post that I am re-watching Dallas from the beginning and am now a few episodes into season 10 (I skipped season 9 Dream Season). This time though, I am watching with my 21 year old daughter who has never seen Dallas before. My daughter is "special needs"...

www.tellytalk.net

 

[Rove]

I think the first major drop was season 9

And to think this should have been when Dallas went scorched Earth with those legacy characters. We witnessed the death of Bobby, the rightful Miss Ellie was back and the writers cleverly weaved Pam into Ewing Oil. The story was right there...sitting in their lap.

I'm fast approaching this season as I continue to binge-watch Dallas on Amazon Prime Australia. Perhaps I'm judging Dallas too harshly but thus far I'm enjoying the ride so I'll be curious what my reaction will be as I continue viewing.

I still hate Jamie Ewing. Actually I like the introduction of the character just cannot warm to the actress.

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

I could do a little research, but refresh my memory..when did he leave the first time? With Katzman in '85?

Yes, Paulsen left in 1985 (along with Katzman, Patrick, Charlene and Art Lweis) and then KNOTS' Peter Dunne came in for a year. Lenny, Paulsen and Patrick came back in '86, Art Lewis came back in '87, and Paulsen left again in '88.

 

[Bobby Southworth]

To be fair, we skipped the dream season and then went back and watched it at the very end. Did a thread about it.

Rewatching Dallas with a newbie

I mentioned in an earlier post that I am re-watching Dallas from the beginning and am now a few episodes into season 10 (I skipped season 9 Dream Season). This time though, I am watching with my 21 year old daughter who has never seen Dallas before. My daughter is "special needs"...

www.tellytalk.net

Thank you for sharing this thread. I will check it out. I remember discovering Dallas while it was still on, and my mom was a big fan. She had watched from the beginning, and I was kinda born with it(January of '78.). So, I remember all these shows(Dallas, Falcon Crest, Knots Landing, and Dynasty) that I couldn't stand for the longest time, but finally at some point in 4th grade they started peaking my interest, and a distant local channel started airing reruns of Dallas. We didn't have cable. The channel was very fuzzy at times, if there was reception at all, and I was hooked when I saw the old Dallas. JR has brown hair? Jock? The theme tune. I loved everything about those early years.

So, your daughter made it through all 14 seasons? I am definitely curious to see how she felt about those last few years.

 

[CeeCee72]

They HATED ever

So, your daughter made it through all 14 seasons? I am definitely curious to see how she felt about those last few years.

Absolutely HATED seasons 11-14. Pam, Donna, and Sue Ellen all gone and Ellie down to basically cameos.

 

[Rove]

and Paulsen left again in '88.

Has Paulsen spoken why he left the series again? He was such a master at story construction - as you've mentioned numerous times - on this site. Did he return to a series which was beyond saving? A clash of egos on how best to move story forward and well away from Bobby returning from the dead.

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

Has Paulsen spoken why he left the series again? He was such a master at story construction - as you've mentioned numerous times - on this site. Did he return to a series which was beyond saving? A clash of egos on how best to move story forward and well away from Bobby returning from the dead.

This site did a good interview with Paulsen almost 20 years ago (as have others, including @Garry's DallasFanzine site).

Paulsen got another offer from collapsing DYNASTY to guide Season 9, where he would be the show-runner. (Paulsen got an earlier offer to join Season 6 of DYNASTY as a lowly writer, but they wouldn't give him creative control;,so he declined, knowing his own work would be compromised; if they'd ceded to his terms, the last-half of DYNASTY would be better-remembered). Paulsen also said he already wanted to leave DALLAS before he got the second offer to be the executive supervising producer of DYNASTY for Season 9 in 1988, and then he accepted it (finally fixing DYNASTY after a long period of creative disorganization, although by the time Paulsen got there, the DYNASTY audience was already gone).

Just why Paulsen wanted to leave DALLAS a second time in '88 is anybody's guess, but when you look at the remaining three years of the show, one can figure out why pretty quickly. Sure, it would have been better for DALLAS if Paulsen stayed, but Katzman & Co. had apparently made the decision to turn DALLAS facetious, and Paulsen was smart enough to not want to make the show that way. (Which is why Larry Hagman sniped in the press that it was "probably a good thing" that Paulsen was leaving DALLAS because "he doesn't have a sense of humor" -- but then the actors of DALLAS and DYNASTY seem to have no awareness at all of Paulsen's contributions to their respective series... I suspect Linda Evans knows: she loved the exit story Paulsen gave her after her having nothing to do for years).

Paulsen is a bit of a company man and is careful with his words, so he has publicly defended the use of The Dream, pretending that it worked. But he would never have used it, had he been running DALLAS himself... That was Katzman's preference, to wipe out the year in which he'd had little involvement (he was listed as a consultant, and wrote some scripts for the season he would later turn into a dream, but he had no control over the plots from Peter Dunne and Dunne's team).

David Jacobs has also said he would have used a different explanation with which to revive Bobby from the dead.

 

[Mustard]

I voted for season 11. Season 10 was the last time Dallas actually felt like Dallas to me. Between the mummy fiasco, Kimberly Cryder, Nick, April, and Lisa, it was just awful.

Oh yeah, isn't season 11 when we got that dreadful Laurel storyline? Gross.

I thought Season 11 DVD felt like Dallas, but the ends no longer joined up well without Pam, and it was now very stale.

Season 12 DVD felt fresher, because it was trying something different.

 

[Mustard]

Has Paulsen spoken why he left the series again?

He went to Dynasty for what turned out to be its last season, i.e. Season 9 (1988-89).

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

He went to Dynasty for what turned out to be its last season, i.e. Season 9 (1988-89).

And its best season in many years.

 

[Mustard]

And its best season in many years.

Absolutely not

 

[Monzo]

I find it remarkable how David Paulsen managed to breathe new life into the Dynasty characters after having just —to put it hyperbolically— drained the life out of the main characters of Dallas during season 11. Still, I wonder where certain characters might have ended up in season 12 under Paulsen's influence. I didn't particularly care for April in season 10, but after Pam and Donna left and Jenna was on her way out and the new ladies introduced in season 11 failed to click, April became a bright spot for me. What would have become of her under Paulsen in season 12. I wonder the same thing about Lucy. Who actually decided that Charlene Tilton should return? Did Paulsen already have a certain storyline for her in mind, or did they simply want her back at the end of season 11, hoping to find suitable material for her later?

So, David Paulsen wasn't part of the fun gang surrounding Leonard Katzman, but was Ken Kercheval actually part of it? I’ve always wondered why, during the budget cuts at the end of season 12, the decision was made to let Sue Ellen go rather than Cliff. Cliff’s story had essentially run its course; it would have made sense for Afton to convince him to move in with her and their daughter and finally leave the toxic environment of Dallas behind. In my opinion, Sue Ellen (following a quick annulment of her marriage to Don) would have offered enough material for the final two seasons.

Regarding the vote for the biggest drop in quality, I’m surprised that season 14 received some votes. During my last rewatch I felt like things were steadily going downhill starting with season 8, yet the drop between seasons 13 and 14 didn't seem all that drastic to me. Of course, I missed Miss Ellie and Lucy, and we didn't see much of Clayton and April, but since newbies James and Michelle already had so much screen time in season 13, season 14—with even more focus on the pair—didn't really come as a shock to me.

I see that season 6 has received one vote – but why? Is it because Rebecca died, or because Bobby and Pam were separated (at least for the time being)?

 

[Snarky Oracle!]

I find it remarkable how David Paulsen managed to breathe new life into the Dynasty characters after having just —to put it hyperbolically— drained the life out of the main characters of Dallas during season 11. Still, I wonder where certain characters might have ended up in season 12 under Paulsen's influence. I didn't particularly care for April in season 10, but after Pam and Donna left and Jenna was on her way out and the new ladies introduced in season 11 failed to click, April became a bright spot for me. What would have become of her under Paulsen in season 12. I wonder the same thing about Lucy. Who actually decided that Charlene Tilton should return? Did Paulsen already have a certain storyline for her in mind, or did they simply want her back at the end of season 11, hoping to find suitable material for her later?

I don't think Paulsen himself drained the life out the characters in Season 11 all by himself, and what was going on at DALLAS at the time was probably the reason he wanted to leave (even before he got the second offer to join wilting DYNASTY).

He didn't have final say on DALLAS -- Katzman did and returning Art Lewis had seniority.

Also, the usual planning time during the spring hiatus never happened in 1987 because Lorimar, anticipating a writers' strike (which was delayed for a year) dictated their shows forgo that normal hiatus and begin filming for Season 11 (the '87-'88 year) right away. So they had to write while they shot. And that had to affect the narrative and the muddled end result that we got.